The creator economy in India is set to soar to new heights in 2023, as influencer marketing and creator economy growth continue to dominate the digital landscape.
We've managed to secure interviews with two of the country's most prominent figures in influencer marketing and creator economy trends - Himani Agrawal & Rishabh Nahar from Only Much Louder (OML). They will divulge a blueprint for success for those looking to make their mark as an aspiring content creator within the burgeoning creator economy India.
Throughout this engaging episode, we will decipher the characteristics of an average Indian content creator, explore top platforms for showcasing their work, and discuss what distinguishes genuinely exceptional creators from merely good ones. Additionally, we'll delve into strategies for developing associated products as a micro-creator, uncover emerging niches within the creator economy trends in 2023, and examine both the current state and future prospects of brand deals for micro-creators.
Show us love!
Know more: thriftytitans.co
Share your thoughts: team@thriftytitans.co
Are you on Insta?: https://www.instagram.com/thrifty.titans/
Maybe LinkedIn?: https://linkedin.com/company/thriftytitans
YouTube? Come on!: https://www.youtube.com/@thrifty.titans
Share your feedback: https://forms.gle/4eSnbyMXQeWXAgc68
00:00:37
Saikat Pyne: Hi. I'm Sekar marketer, creative and media nerd. Welcome to
00:00:43
Saikat Pyne: the you incorporated podcast On this show, I catch up
00:00:47
Saikat Pyne: with some of the most bad ass founders, business leaders
00:00:51
Saikat Pyne: and content creators in the whole wide world. Whether you're
00:00:55
Saikat Pyne: a marketer, creative or a budding founder, if you want
00:00:59
Saikat Pyne: to build your brand your voice your way, you are
00:01:03
Saikat Pyne: in the right place.
00:01:05
Saikat Pyne: Join me on the you incorporated podcast and start building
00:01:09
Saikat Pyne: your empire. Here we go.
00:01:21
Saikat Pyne: Please join me in welcoming him. Mani Agrawal, senior vice
00:01:25
Saikat Pyne: president product and analytics at O. M. L Hii is
00:01:30
Saikat Pyne: accompanied by Rishabh Nahar. He's the senior vice president of
00:01:34
Saikat Pyne: talent management at O M. L. And in his current role,
00:01:38
Saikat Pyne: he's tasked to expand the roster of O M L
00:01:41
Saikat Pyne: O M L. As a sort of a monopoly on
00:01:43
Saikat Pyne: comedy talent in India. Rehab's job is to expand the
00:01:46
Saikat Pyne: roster beyond comedy to creators and influencers from various genres.
00:01:52
Saikat Pyne: Welcome to the Show him
00:01:53
Rishabh Nahar: and dress up. Thank you for having us lovely being here.
00:01:56
Saikat Pyne: Thanks, Michael. Great being here.
00:01:59
Saikat Pyne: Rachel, you are
00:02:02
Saikat Pyne: in charge of the talent management business at O m. L,
00:02:06
Saikat Pyne: which I'm sure makes up a huge piece of the
00:02:09
Saikat Pyne: revenue pile as well. Could you give me a sense
00:02:12
Saikat Pyne: of what does the creator, uh, economy look like right
00:02:17
Saikat Pyne: now in terms of platforms, age of creators and where
00:02:21
Saikat Pyne: they are from? Primarily,
00:02:23
Rishabh Nahar: I will be able to give you a better sense
00:02:25
Rishabh Nahar: on the accurate numbers because of her two hypotheses. And
00:02:28
Rishabh Nahar: she's been leading that. But from an overview topline, I think, obviously,
00:02:33
Rishabh Nahar: in India, the creator economy, as this is now termed
00:02:37
Rishabh Nahar: India probably is one of the leading markets. And if
00:02:39
Rishabh Nahar: you see a lot of platforms and have spent a
00:02:42
Rishabh Nahar: lot of money and are pumping in a lot more
00:02:44
Rishabh Nahar: money within the creator economy and putting that bet O
00:02:47
Rishabh Nahar: by and large has been specifically known as a comedy
00:02:50
Rishabh Nahar: talent management company. But in the last three years, and
00:02:53
Rishabh Nahar: we've always tried to be ahead of the curve, we've
00:02:55
Rishabh Nahar: tried to identify trends thanks to her and they
00:03:00
Saikat Pyne: Yep, yep, I'm the numbers person. Guys I can I
00:03:02
Saikat Pyne: can go on and on about this, but at a
00:03:04
Saikat Pyne: top level, it's a younger generation that is producing content.
00:03:08
Saikat Pyne: When you look at male and female distribution, right? 67%
00:03:12
Saikat Pyne: of female creators are in the age of 18 to
00:03:15
Saikat Pyne: 24 only 22% and 25 to 34. So that's how
00:03:19
Saikat Pyne: the female creators are distributed. But the male creators are
00:03:22
Saikat Pyne: more equal in the sense that
00:03:24
Saikat Pyne: 4% is in the 18 to 24 ver versus a
00:03:28
Saikat Pyne: similar 43% in 25 to 34. And that's the primary
00:03:32
Saikat Pyne: age group. Apart from that, there's 56% here and there.
00:03:35
Saikat Pyne: That's also skewed towards younger than 18 creators. But a
00:03:39
Saikat Pyne: lot of this is to information that honestly has to
00:03:42
Saikat Pyne: be taken with a pinch of salt. If you look
00:03:44
Saikat Pyne: at high level numbers, they are estimated, at least in India.
00:03:47
Saikat Pyne: Eight creators create content, so that's a huge number. It's
00:03:52
Saikat Pyne: quite big,
00:03:53
Saikat Pyne: but not all of them are able to monetize. So
00:03:56
Saikat Pyne: if you look at professional content creators like, if you
00:03:59
Saikat Pyne: want to it like that who are able to make
00:04:01
Saikat Pyne: money off of the content that they create, that's only
00:04:04
Saikat Pyne: around 100 and 50 across all of the platforms, so
00:04:08
Saikat Pyne: to speak. So I also I think YouTube would be
00:04:11
Saikat Pyne: a little bit more niche right around 40 to 50 creators.
00:04:16
Saikat Pyne: And of course, you can't really
00:04:18
Saikat Pyne: distribute that by because creators will be on multiple platforms.
00:04:22
Saikat Pyne: A lot of creators, a lot of those which are
00:04:24
Saikat Pyne: on YouTube, will either be on insta and Facebook or
00:04:28
Saikat Pyne: one of them at least, so it's gonna be a
00:04:30
Saikat Pyne: mix of that. But as the short form content is
00:04:33
Saikat Pyne: really coming up these days, and a lot of creators
00:04:37
Saikat Pyne: are moving to those platforms as well. The 150 I
00:04:40
Saikat Pyne: would say, are distributed across these three platforms, with YouTube
00:04:43
Saikat Pyne: being the most niche
00:04:45
Saikat Pyne: and the other platforms having a bigger chunk of this
00:04:48
Saikat Pyne: 150 creators creators so that create content. 50 is what
00:04:54
Saikat Pyne: we estimate, which are actually able to monetize their content
00:04:58
Saikat Pyne: and what we call it professional creators. And that's what
00:05:02
Saikat Pyne: it looks like in terms of the distribution. So in
00:05:04
Saikat Pyne: terms of the platform, split for creators is the biggest
00:05:09
Saikat Pyne: chunk in India still with YouTube, And could you give
00:05:13
Saikat Pyne: me a very rough breakdown of the 12345 in terms
00:05:18
Saikat Pyne: of the top platforms for Indian creators?
00:05:20
Rishabh Nahar: If your question is on which platform is still being
00:05:24
Rishabh Nahar: used the most to monetize out the Instagram, primarily because
00:05:27
Rishabh Nahar: that
00:05:28
Rishabh Nahar: technically has become one of the biggest search engines. In
00:05:31
Rishabh Nahar: my opinion, it's not a social media platform anymore. It's
00:05:35
Rishabh Nahar: a search engine, and you can literally just in their search.
00:05:38
Rishabh Nahar: You can type music. You can type restaurants in a
00:05:41
Rishabh Nahar: certain area and things will pop up with images you
00:05:44
Rishabh Nahar: can
00:05:44
Rishabh Nahar: the number of people moving there. So it's technically become
00:05:47
Rishabh Nahar: a search engine now primarily, of course, to discover creators
00:05:51
Rishabh Nahar: and for creators to distribute that, but also in the
00:05:54
Rishabh Nahar: way in which you can monetize on instagram with brands
00:05:57
Rishabh Nahar: pumping in the most money on instagram. And it also
00:06:01
Rishabh Nahar: gives you the ability
00:06:03
Rishabh Nahar: to put short form content now slightly longer term content
00:06:06
Rishabh Nahar: as well long form content as well. You've got these
00:06:09
Rishabh Nahar: shops button. You've got a bunch of these things that
00:06:12
Rishabh Nahar: they have simplified now on instagram, right? So it becomes
00:06:15
Rishabh Nahar: a one top distribution place for creator. It also becomes
00:06:19
Rishabh Nahar: a very lucrative monetization platform for the creators as well.
00:06:23
Saikat Pyne: Richard, in terms of the creators that you are on boarding,
00:06:26
Saikat Pyne: what is your perception of
00:06:28
Saikat Pyne: platforms that Indian creators are generally leaning towards. So
00:06:31
Rishabh Nahar: one inside which we through one of our comedians, Rahul Soman.
00:06:35
Rishabh Nahar: And he is. I think he featured the top five
00:06:39
Rishabh Nahar: or top 10 leading and on LinkedIn. So you see
00:06:42
Rishabh Nahar: the type of content he puts right? It's just PR
00:06:45
Rishabh Nahar: comedy that he puts and on a platform like LinkedIn.
00:06:48
Rishabh Nahar: In fact, most of our inquiries or Corporates of brand
00:06:52
Rishabh Nahar: led performance marketing that comes from LinkedIn because all our
00:06:55
Rishabh Nahar: brand managers are out there. They're looking at content they're
00:06:57
Rishabh Nahar: seeing what's happening is actually feeding into their hands right
00:07:01
Rishabh Nahar: on LinkedIn that one of the platforms that I don't
00:07:04
Rishabh Nahar: think anyone has been able
00:07:05
Rishabh Nahar: sort of cracks like I don't think anyone's proactively even
00:07:09
Rishabh Nahar: looking at as a platform on which you can monetize
00:07:12
Rishabh Nahar: it is not paying you. But it's an avenue through
00:07:14
Rishabh Nahar: which you can get your partners and clients. So it's
00:07:17
Rishabh Nahar: basically bridging the gap between a brand manager and a
00:07:20
Rishabh Nahar: creator by Discovery. Um,
00:07:23
Rishabh Nahar: Instagram, of course, indirectly pays you revenues now. Like I said,
00:07:27
Rishabh Nahar: you've got that shop button. You can purchase products off
00:07:30
Rishabh Nahar: just by tapping on a creator's picture, and you can
00:07:33
Rishabh Nahar: see how much cost, how much that dress or shoe costs, right?
00:07:37
Rishabh Nahar: So those things now exist on Instagram. They're all monetize.
00:07:41
Rishabh Nahar: You can boost ads,
00:07:43
Rishabh Nahar: brands pay you enough money. Or at least they're now
00:07:46
Rishabh Nahar: way more comfortable in paying money to the performance marketing
00:07:49
Rishabh Nahar: on instagram. But instagram, of course, I think is a
00:07:52
Rishabh Nahar: primary source, but you've also got YouTube YouTube. I think primarily,
00:07:56
Rishabh Nahar: at least on our roster, is being used for catches
00:07:59
Rishabh Nahar: and for anything. That's a brand led content piece, which
00:08:02
Rishabh Nahar: is slightly more long form. So anything that's obviously above five,
00:08:05
Rishabh Nahar: which needs a larger integration, which is more
00:08:08
Rishabh Nahar: conversational. It is a sketch based content piece. All of
00:08:12
Rishabh Nahar: these reside on YouTube. So, for example, someone who we
00:08:15
Rishabh Nahar: represent Dali Singh. She's one of the leading creators. She
00:08:19
Rishabh Nahar: does a lot of sketches and plays a lot of
00:08:21
Rishabh Nahar: characters on Instagram. These are again, primarily short form. But
00:08:24
Rishabh Nahar: if she were to build an episodic release of these characters,
00:08:29
Rishabh Nahar: which is slightly more long form, then this goes on
00:08:32
Rishabh Nahar: a platform like YouTube.
00:08:33
Rishabh Nahar: Now when it's going to go on YouTube, we'll then
00:08:36
Rishabh Nahar: start looking at brands to come on board. We look
00:08:38
Rishabh Nahar: at various ways to be able to monetize this. You've
00:08:41
Rishabh Nahar: got ad revenue on YouTube, so there are a couple
00:08:43
Rishabh Nahar: of
00:08:43
Rishabh Nahar: other doors that open with each platform. Ankush Bagua is
00:08:47
Rishabh Nahar: someone we represent, but he has a page called Wing
00:08:50
Rishabh Nahar: It with Ankush on Instagram. We've been putting a lot
00:08:52
Rishabh Nahar: of content pieces there, but we managed to get lack
00:08:55
Rishabh Nahar: on board for a four or a five part series,
00:08:58
Rishabh Nahar: which is now on YouTube, so they both go hand
00:09:01
Rishabh Nahar: in hand. But it depends on the kind of output
00:09:04
Rishabh Nahar: the brand is looking at, and it also depends on
00:09:06
Rishabh Nahar: what which audience and what demographics the creator wants to create.
00:09:10
Rishabh Nahar: Instagram is a completely different audience altogether. YouTube, in my opinion,
00:09:15
Rishabh Nahar: is a slightly different audience. I
00:09:16
Saikat Pyne: was going through a couple of the Creator reports, and
00:09:20
Saikat Pyne: the numbers are really astonishing. Um, it said that around 68%
00:09:25
Saikat Pyne: of all creators globally are working part time
00:09:30
Saikat Pyne: and only 10% are earning around 100 K plus annually,
00:09:34
Saikat Pyne: and more than 80% of all creators are micro influencers.
00:09:39
Saikat Pyne: What is the landscape like in India? How hard is
00:09:42
Saikat Pyne: it to get to the top 1% of Instagram or YouTube.
00:09:47
Saikat Pyne: It's a good question, and the landscape, if you look
00:09:49
Saikat Pyne: at the distribution, is exactly similar. The long tail of
00:09:52
Saikat Pyne: creators and micro creators is just huge,
00:09:55
Saikat Pyne: and the definition of creator is also so loose right?
00:09:58
Saikat Pyne: We are all posting on social media. So when do
00:10:01
Saikat Pyne: we actually become creators, as opposed to usual social posts?
00:10:06
Saikat Pyne: As such, right and getting followers is consistently is what
00:10:12
Saikat Pyne: makes you a real creator, right? Like, how do you
00:10:14
Saikat Pyne: keep your audiences engaged, that they're coming back to watch
00:10:18
Saikat Pyne: your content, to engage with you to advocate your content
00:10:22
Saikat Pyne: content so other people discover you and and make that.
00:10:26
Saikat Pyne: How do I say that commitment to following you as
00:10:29
Saikat Pyne: a creator is where the difference comes in between an
00:10:32
Saikat Pyne: average social person versus someone who is a content creator
00:10:36
Saikat Pyne: crossing the threshold? It's all about feeding in the algorithm
00:10:39
Saikat Pyne: and consistency honestly, like if you are aspiring to be
00:10:42
Saikat Pyne: a creator, you need to understand what is the means
00:10:45
Saikat Pyne: that you're catering to. How do you engage that
00:10:48
Saikat Pyne: need and how do you create consistently and understand your
00:10:52
Saikat Pyne: analytics to be able to come back to the platform
00:10:56
Saikat Pyne: work with the algorithm. The algorithm itself also changes quite frequently,
00:11:01
Saikat Pyne: but as long as a creator you are consistent in
00:11:04
Saikat Pyne: your content and your content messaging your language. It is
00:11:08
Saikat Pyne: not that difficult. The difficulty comes in, I think, when
00:11:12
Saikat Pyne: it comes to just getting it to
00:11:15
Saikat Pyne: that scale because you're able to be in that specific niche.
00:11:19
Saikat Pyne: But yet your niche is larger than 20 people. For example,
00:11:23
Saikat Pyne: how do you get beyond being a local creator? Like
00:11:26
Saikat Pyne: when I say local, I literally mean in people are
00:11:29
Saikat Pyne: following this fitness instructor because he's really great versus being
00:11:34
Saikat Pyne: someone who is popular in the city, in the state
00:11:38
Saikat Pyne: or in the country or globally. How do you make
00:11:40
Saikat Pyne: that jump? And that's where the challenge comes in.
00:11:45
Saikat Pyne: Sure, sure him with with hypothesis, if I may tease
00:11:49
Saikat Pyne: it a bit, you are working on this E. I
00:11:52
Saikat Pyne: platform that will connect Brand and their customers with the
00:11:56
Saikat Pyne: right creator in India. When you're speaking about the average creator,
00:12:00
Saikat Pyne: what is the part-time versus full-time split at the moment?
00:12:04
Saikat Pyne: Based on their income, more than 90% of the creators
00:12:07
Saikat Pyne: are part-time creators, like they do have something that they
00:12:11
Saikat Pyne: do full time.
00:12:12
Saikat Pyne: And just because the monetary aspect of it is not
00:12:15
Saikat Pyne: supporting them to be full time creators, right, they need
00:12:18
Saikat Pyne: to earn the money they need to be able to
00:12:20
Saikat Pyne: support family. It's less than 1% of professional creators that
00:12:24
Saikat Pyne: are able to cross that threshold of two lacs per month.
00:12:28
Saikat Pyne: I and R I'm talking. So yeah, 1% of Indian
00:12:32
Saikat Pyne: creators are able to cross that threshold, and that's a
00:12:34
Saikat Pyne: very small number, right? And when you look at that
00:12:37
Saikat Pyne: reality and when, I say professional creators are going back
00:12:40
Saikat Pyne: to the number originally 1 50 k,
00:12:42
Saikat Pyne: that range is around $200 per month to 2.5 K
00:12:46
Saikat Pyne: dollars per month. So that's 16 to ₹2 lakh. So
00:12:50
Saikat Pyne: that's a range for what you call professional creators. So
00:12:53
Saikat Pyne: obviously they are not Full-time creators, right? Wow, So these
00:12:56
Saikat Pyne: numbers are eyeopeners. They are coming back to the topic
00:13:00
Saikat Pyne: of creators who are able to do this full time.
00:13:02
Saikat Pyne: What is the difference
00:13:04
Saikat Pyne: between creators that o. M. L on boards? I think
00:13:08
Saikat Pyne: they are successful enough. What is the difference between these
00:13:11
Saikat Pyne: creators and other creators. What are they doing right? Or
00:13:14
Saikat Pyne: is it they just happen to be at the right
00:13:16
Saikat Pyne: place at the right time, creating the right type of
00:13:18
Saikat Pyne: content and found an audience?
00:13:19
Rishabh Nahar: I think that's a little bit of both. To be honest,
00:13:22
Rishabh Nahar: I don't think it's not like
00:13:24
Rishabh Nahar: the creators that women represent working harder because each of
00:13:27
Rishabh Nahar: them work hard. But it's not like people we don't
00:13:29
Rishabh Nahar: represent don't work hard enough. I think one of the
00:13:31
Rishabh Nahar: differences is that our creators have been in this for
00:13:34
Rishabh Nahar: the longest time. I think the batch of comedians that
00:13:37
Rishabh Nahar: we represent have been with us since 2014 and most
00:13:40
Rishabh Nahar: of them have been here for 5 to 8 years.
00:13:42
Rishabh Nahar: They've seen the highs and lows that have been
00:13:44
Rishabh Nahar: times where we have not necessarily been able to hit
00:13:47
Rishabh Nahar: the commitments that we had made both financially and otherwise.
00:13:50
Rishabh Nahar: There have been times when they have taken breaks for
00:13:53
Rishabh Nahar: whatever reason than their whole financial numbers or targets weren't
00:13:56
Rishabh Nahar: met or the economy has impacted in a way where
00:13:59
Rishabh Nahar: we've not been able to achieve certain goals. But they've
00:14:01
Rishabh Nahar: seen a lot of these highs and lows. They've seen
00:14:04
Rishabh Nahar: the landscape change. Most of them have been around for
00:14:08
Rishabh Nahar: a while, and they've seen this overall landscape change in
00:14:11
Rishabh Nahar: a way where they know
00:14:13
Rishabh Nahar: that if there is a down time that's going to happen,
00:14:16
Rishabh Nahar: they know how to tackle that. I think a lot
00:14:18
Rishabh Nahar: of creators have sopped up very recently in the last
00:14:21
Rishabh Nahar: year or so. Um, and these are very new, right?
00:14:25
Rishabh Nahar: And when I say new, I mean that these are
00:14:27
Rishabh Nahar: 24 hours, one week sensation creators that have cropped up
00:14:31
Rishabh Nahar: because a couple of a couple of assets have gone viral.
00:14:35
Rishabh Nahar: I think sustaining is primarily the most important aspect in
00:14:40
Rishabh Nahar: a creative life cycle. That is something that, as it's
00:14:44
Rishabh Nahar: our as managers, it's our job to kind of. But
00:14:47
Rishabh Nahar: the key, metric again is to be able to build
00:14:50
Rishabh Nahar: longevity into the life cycle of a creator, which means
00:14:54
Rishabh Nahar: diversifying as much of their brand to be able to
00:14:59
Rishabh Nahar: monetize this and again.
00:15:01
Rishabh Nahar: All of this only works if that creator wants to.
00:15:04
Rishabh Nahar: I don't think as managers, we have the right to
00:15:06
Rishabh Nahar: tell them that this is the only way, and this
00:15:08
Rishabh Nahar: is how things are supposed to be done. It is
00:15:10
Rishabh Nahar: their careers. They've vin it. We just enabler. So we
00:15:14
Rishabh Nahar: share that vision with them, and then we build the
00:15:15
Rishabh Nahar: machinery of the back and
00:15:17
Saikat Pyne: just to dig in a bit into his story because
00:15:21
Saikat Pyne: his story with biryani is one which is very unique.
00:15:25
Saikat Pyne: Of course, we've seen Mr Beast with the beast burgers,
00:15:28
Saikat Pyne: but I don't remember an Indian creator launching into the
00:15:33
Saikat Pyne: F M B space in the way that Zakir has.
00:15:36
Saikat Pyne: How did you come to this idea?
00:15:38
Rishabh Nahar: This was actually the idea. And the entire execution primarily
00:15:42
Rishabh Nahar: was done by one of our founders, Ajay and R.
00:15:45
Rishabh Nahar: C o. The idea basically came upon by like I
00:15:48
Rishabh Nahar: mentioned the creator that runs with the idea. For the
00:15:51
Rishabh Nahar: longest time, we all know that Zakir talks about his
00:15:53
Rishabh Nahar: love for biryani. Whenever he travel
00:15:56
Rishabh Nahar: outside of India, he'll always though his first question is
00:15:58
Rishabh Nahar: going to be on Instagram. Please tell me where can
00:16:01
Rishabh Nahar: I find authentic biryani? Right. So when you think Zakir Khan, you,
00:16:04
Rishabh Nahar: by default will either think you think biryani, you think right?
00:16:09
Rishabh Nahar: These are the 34 very key bits of Zakir that
00:16:12
Rishabh Nahar: are associated with his personality. and obviously we were discussing that.
00:16:16
Rishabh Nahar: How can we build longevity? How can we build a
00:16:18
Rishabh Nahar: more sustainable, longer term vision for the artists where
00:16:23
Rishabh Nahar: the artist or the creator may not necessarily
00:16:26
Rishabh Nahar: keep doing things that you don't need to actually be
00:16:29
Rishabh Nahar: on stage? Lend your voice. How do we take a
00:16:31
Rishabh Nahar: piece of the artists of their personality and basically look
00:16:34
Rishabh Nahar: at it as How can we lease the artist's name?
00:16:36
Rishabh Nahar: And this opportunity came by. We worked with the founders.
00:16:39
Rishabh Nahar: They are very keen to partner with us. They came
00:16:42
Rishabh Nahar: with an
00:16:42
Rishabh Nahar: idea where it was slightly different. It wasn't necessarily a partnership,
00:16:47
Rishabh Nahar: but more of a on a marketing standpoint. But obviously,
00:16:51
Rishabh Nahar: when we joined forces, we discussed on how best can
00:16:53
Rishabh Nahar: we make it most viable for both the partners and
00:16:56
Rishabh Nahar: for Zak? Because
00:16:58
Rishabh Nahar: it's as important for a creator to be investing and
00:17:01
Rishabh Nahar: have skin in the game as much as it is
00:17:04
Rishabh Nahar: for the product owner. And that's how this kind of
00:17:07
Rishabh Nahar: product came into being right. It has Zak's name on it.
00:17:09
Rishabh Nahar: A couple of the dishes are named after Zakir as well,
00:17:12
Rishabh Nahar: so it's just a very beautiful marriage where you've got
00:17:15
Rishabh Nahar: a product. You've got an artist who has always been
00:17:17
Rishabh Nahar: talking about the products being that product with other founders
00:17:20
Rishabh Nahar: and the artists together. And for us, it makes so
00:17:23
Rishabh Nahar: much more sense because
00:17:25
Rishabh Nahar: we don't have to go and learn everything from scratch,
00:17:27
Rishabh Nahar: right there is someone who comes in with the experience
00:17:30
Rishabh Nahar: of the back end of the hospitality industry. And as
00:17:33
Rishabh Nahar: much as people take the hospitality industry best there 30 35% margins.
00:17:37
Rishabh Nahar: So it's not always true. There are a lot of
00:17:40
Rishabh Nahar: challenges that come if business comes with with a strong challenge.
00:17:43
Rishabh Nahar: But
00:17:43
Rishabh Nahar: till the time we don't try, we'll never one will
00:17:46
Rishabh Nahar: never learn. Right now, the next deal that we do
00:17:48
Rishabh Nahar: and we're about to do a couple of them with
00:17:50
Rishabh Nahar: a few of our other creators, we learn from our metrics.
00:17:53
Rishabh Nahar: We'll look at things in a much more different perspective
00:17:56
Rishabh Nahar: because we also then become the artists also become business owners.
00:17:59
Rishabh Nahar: So that's literally how the idea was came about where
00:18:02
Rishabh Nahar: we're like, How best can we leave an artist's name,
00:18:04
Rishabh Nahar: because how many times do the artists physically be present
00:18:07
Rishabh Nahar: to be able to
00:18:08
Rishabh Nahar: things your oz does look up. One of the few
00:18:11
Rishabh Nahar: things that does is he talks about he which ways
00:18:15
Rishabh Nahar: loves BII. Story obviously will talk about his brand. We
00:18:18
Rishabh Nahar: use these in a multi in multiple other shows as well.
00:18:21
Rishabh Nahar: So every time these sales happen for the Biniak by
00:18:24
Rishabh Nahar: default is also making something at the back end of this.
00:18:27
Rishabh Nahar: So it's a win win for everyone.
00:18:29
Saikat Pyne: But we had Mr Jug Chima, the co founder
00:18:33
Saikat Pyne: of Media, and I was having a chat with about
00:18:37
Saikat Pyne: flipping the switch and going from being a creator to
00:18:41
Saikat Pyne: an entrepreneur. A CRE please. Right when it comes to
00:18:45
Saikat Pyne: creators who are on boarded with you, how closely are
00:18:49
Saikat Pyne: they attached to the business of
00:18:52
Rishabh Nahar: them? Very much, actually. So from a obviously from an
00:18:56
Rishabh Nahar: art form standpoint, they are the business within themselves, right?
00:19:01
Rishabh Nahar: They are the chief for the way we look at it.
00:19:02
Rishabh Nahar: As the creator of the chief creative officer, we're the
00:19:06
Rishabh Nahar: chief business officer. That's how we look at it and
00:19:08
Rishabh Nahar: where one is
00:19:08
Rishabh Nahar: unit working for each other towards a same towards the
00:19:12
Rishabh Nahar: same goal, right? So that's how we this between us,
00:19:15
Rishabh Nahar: but they're very much involved in the numbers in the
00:19:18
Rishabh Nahar: way the business is shaping the way pitches are being made, because,
00:19:22
Rishabh Nahar: let's be honest, I think for us when we're making pitches,
00:19:26
Rishabh Nahar: we can always make a great pitch. But
00:19:29
Rishabh Nahar: you can win a pitch when you've got the artist's
00:19:31
Rishabh Nahar: personality in it. Right when we're making bigger pictures, we're
00:19:34
Rishabh Nahar: always speaking to our artists as well. They're also with
00:19:37
Rishabh Nahar: us in a couple of rooms where we think it
00:19:39
Rishabh Nahar: makes so much more impact for the founders or for
00:19:42
Rishabh Nahar: the clients to hear directly from the artist on the vision, right?
00:19:45
Rishabh Nahar: I think those are key things where we work together,
00:19:47
Rishabh Nahar: as I feel a lot of people shield their artists
00:19:50
Rishabh Nahar: from such situation where they're like, No, we are the gatekeepers,
00:19:53
Rishabh Nahar: So only we will talk to the client. The artist
00:19:56
Rishabh Nahar: shouldn't
00:19:56
Rishabh Nahar: I feel there isn't any. I don't think there's anything
00:19:58
Rishabh Nahar: wrong with working as a business unit and, you know,
00:20:01
Rishabh Nahar: trying to share your vision with with a client or
00:20:04
Rishabh Nahar: with the promoter instead and every artist is very much
00:20:08
Rishabh Nahar: in tune. So that art form is their bread and
00:20:10
Rishabh Nahar: butter right it that it their art form is that personality.
00:20:13
Rishabh Nahar: That personality is what gets the audience going on, that
00:20:16
Rishabh Nahar: what has made them reach where they are, anything from
00:20:19
Rishabh Nahar: a business and fund. It impacts their name directly. So
00:20:22
Rishabh Nahar: if we are dealing on behalf of any artist, the
00:20:25
Rishabh Nahar: deal that is being brokered is directly impacting the name
00:20:28
Rishabh Nahar: of the artist and the brand equity of that artist, right?
00:20:31
Rishabh Nahar: All of the deals are made very consciously. They're always
00:20:35
Rishabh Nahar: in sync or we discuss deals with the artist while
00:20:37
Rishabh Nahar: we're taking it to the client. So we work very
00:20:40
Rishabh Nahar: much in tune with them.
00:20:42
Rishabh Nahar: But I think in India in general, I feel like
00:20:45
Rishabh Nahar: the business sensibility may not necessarily exist within the market.
00:20:49
Rishabh Nahar: From a creator standpoint, I think it it should rather
00:20:53
Rishabh Nahar: become one of those things where
00:20:55
Rishabh Nahar: creators should know where the money is coming from, where
00:20:58
Rishabh Nahar: it's going. How is it like how are they making
00:21:00
Rishabh Nahar: the money, how the pitch is being made? Because they
00:21:03
Rishabh Nahar: also realise the kind of efforts that go behind building
00:21:06
Rishabh Nahar: all of this and their opinions 100% man, if there
00:21:09
Rishabh Nahar: is a way in which something can be tweaked, I
00:21:11
Rishabh Nahar: think we should definitely give them a year and figure
00:21:14
Rishabh Nahar: out how to make it work better.
00:21:16
Saikat Pyne: The other thing that I really wanted to ask you
00:21:19
Saikat Pyne: is that if I am a micro creator and I
00:21:22
Saikat Pyne: don't have the reach or the skill to be able
00:21:25
Saikat Pyne: to reach out to an O. M. L and Rehab
00:21:27
Saikat Pyne: to help me diversify my earning potential, if you could
00:21:31
Saikat Pyne: give the blueprint for how any creator can come up
00:21:35
Saikat Pyne: with ideas for associated products that blend seamlessly with their
00:21:40
Saikat Pyne: brand
00:21:41
Rishabh Nahar: from a micro in front of and when I think
00:21:44
Rishabh Nahar: I think the best way is to just find your
00:21:46
Rishabh Nahar: own voice and run with it. If food is something
00:21:49
Rishabh Nahar: that the Creator likes, and that's what they want to
00:21:51
Rishabh Nahar: continue talking about and that's what makes them happy, I
00:21:54
Rishabh Nahar: think they should keep talking about it. Keep doing content
00:21:57
Rishabh Nahar: around it because tell them they don't like a certain
00:22:00
Rishabh Nahar: genre or a subgenre. It will become a to do
00:22:02
Rishabh Nahar: thing for them, and the minute it's a to do
00:22:04
Rishabh Nahar: thing for them.
00:22:05
Rishabh Nahar: It's effort, right and effort, then also comes with some laziness.
00:22:10
Rishabh Nahar: K k. I don't want to do it today, et cetera.
00:22:13
Rishabh Nahar: I think if they find their voice. And if they
00:22:15
Rishabh Nahar: do the things that they love, it will be so
00:22:17
Rishabh Nahar: much more easier. It won't feel like a job, but
00:22:19
Rishabh Nahar: more like a fun activity. And I think once that
00:22:22
Rishabh Nahar: niche is sound, your audience will start growing and brands
00:22:26
Rishabh Nahar: by default, then will have visibility. And OK, Creator is
00:22:30
Rishabh Nahar: recognised with why.
00:22:33
Rishabh Nahar: Let's work with them on some ad campaign on one
00:22:36
Rishabh Nahar: performance marketing. See how that goes. And then
00:22:39
Rishabh Nahar: it becomes recurring right and one leads to the other,
00:22:41
Rishabh Nahar: and that leads to a third one. And I think
00:22:43
Rishabh Nahar: right now enough platforms have a lot of tools for
00:22:47
Rishabh Nahar: people to monetize. YouTube has got super chat. There are donations, fundraisers.
00:22:52
Rishabh Nahar: You've got ads in the middle of your streams, right?
00:22:54
Rishabh Nahar: You won't have to be at scale. Somebody with five
00:22:57
Rishabh Nahar: followers can also monetize all of these things.
00:23:00
Saikat Pyne: What are the main couple of genres that you put
00:23:03
Saikat Pyne: money on? General content consumption wise on social media?
00:23:07
Saikat Pyne: Yeah, music has always been the top, so that's one
00:23:09
Saikat Pyne: of the things. But that's also because of record label.
00:23:12
Saikat Pyne: But other than that, general entertainment is definitely a winner
00:23:15
Saikat Pyne: across the board like any sort of entertainment content, be
00:23:19
Saikat Pyne: it mixed with travel or comedy or general skit Entertainment
00:23:23
Saikat Pyne: has always been doing well and will continue to do well.
00:23:26
Saikat Pyne: And then there are pockets of niches, right? Like you
00:23:29
Saikat Pyne: have your finance grows or your technical folks that talk
00:23:32
Saikat Pyne: about products and gadgets and things like
00:23:35
Saikat Pyne: that. And in those issues, there are obviously creators that
00:23:38
Saikat Pyne: are also doing very well. Fitness is one of the
00:23:40
Saikat Pyne: categories that have come up fitness, and one less as
00:23:43
Saikat Pyne: a whole has come up recently, especially during the pandemic,
00:23:46
Saikat Pyne: with people having a lot of mental health issues. So
00:23:49
Saikat Pyne: that's something that a lot more people are talking about
00:23:52
Saikat Pyne: and a lot of creators have come up when we
00:23:54
Saikat Pyne: are speaking about monetization opportunities for creators, primarily was looking
00:24:00
Saikat Pyne: at the C P MC on YouTube. They are abysmal,
00:24:03
Saikat Pyne: really, across the emerging world. So, quite naturally, most creators,
00:24:08
Saikat Pyne: the lion's share of their monetization comes from brand deals, right?
00:24:11
Saikat Pyne: What is the future of a brand deal primarily for
00:24:16
Saikat Pyne: these long tail creators going to look like you think? Right.
00:24:19
Saikat Pyne: So I think we have talked a little bit about
00:24:22
Saikat Pyne: it when it comes to the social commerce angle right?
00:24:25
Saikat Pyne: Both creators and the platforms themselves have been enabling social
00:24:29
Saikat Pyne: commerce in a big way because that's where
00:24:31
Saikat Pyne: going forward, it's going to be the easiest integration, be
00:24:35
Saikat Pyne: it from a creator's perspective or from a brand perspective, right?
00:24:38
Saikat Pyne: You're talking about a brand. You're creating content. Why not
00:24:41
Saikat Pyne: let you find that that product right there and then
00:24:44
Saikat Pyne: and make the purchase right? But specifically to answer your
00:24:48
Saikat Pyne: question about the long tail of creators? I think it's
00:24:51
Saikat Pyne: all about automation, definitely that that will play a huge role.
00:24:55
Saikat Pyne: As as this economy grows more towards monetization
00:25:00
Saikat Pyne: social, it's very good. The product is like hypothesis. That's
00:25:03
Saikat Pyne: what we are going to build into our product as well,
00:25:05
Saikat Pyne: Where we are looking at a brand just mentioning what
00:25:09
Saikat Pyne: their brief is, and especially when it comes to large
00:25:12
Saikat Pyne: scale activations, right? Maybe they are launching a new product.
00:25:15
Saikat Pyne: Maybe they're coming up with a new campaign or discounts
00:25:19
Saikat Pyne: things like that. It's all about finding a relevant creator
00:25:23
Saikat Pyne: but not being as specific or not being as picky.
00:25:26
Saikat Pyne: And that's something that can definitely be
00:25:28
Saikat Pyne: automated. When the brief is put out this information. Talk
00:25:32
Saikat Pyne: about the brand once away. Maybe it's a short video.
00:25:35
Saikat Pyne: Maybe it's a meme or a video meme. Or maybe
00:25:38
Saikat Pyne: it's just a small photograph that's being put. The brief
00:25:41
Saikat Pyne: is simple. The verification process is not that complicated. A
00:25:44
Saikat Pyne: system like hypothesis can definitely match that to the relevant creator,
00:25:49
Saikat Pyne: and the job of the brand is going to be
00:25:50
Saikat Pyne: as easy as just saying yes to the creators and
00:25:53
Saikat Pyne: match their criteria, or setting a bulk
00:25:56
Saikat Pyne: materials to reject creators and and processes like this already
00:26:00
Saikat Pyne: exist in plan in countries like US, where it's so
00:26:04
Saikat Pyne: automated as saying, there's a new coupon code coming up
00:26:07
Saikat Pyne: in the next month and it just reaches the relevant creators,
00:26:10
Saikat Pyne: and they just put out the content through an automated
00:26:13
Saikat Pyne: system that already exists. So it's not something that's not happening,
00:26:17
Saikat Pyne: especially because Copen codes is very popular in the US
00:26:21
Saikat Pyne: as an economy, even back in the day when people
00:26:23
Saikat Pyne: used to cut
00:26:24
Saikat Pyne: coupons from newspapers. So that's something that has been a
00:26:28
Saikat Pyne: tradition there. But it's it's becoming more and more popular,
00:26:31
Saikat Pyne: like I personally. Also, when I shop for very niche
00:26:35
Saikat Pyne: type of content like maybe painting supplies. For example. I
00:26:38
Saikat Pyne: know creators that are affiliated with these niche brands and
00:26:41
Saikat Pyne: have that open codes. And it's a long standing coupon code.
00:26:44
Saikat Pyne: It just exists, right? And that's the future for these
00:26:47
Saikat Pyne: niche creators, where they have a very specific audience that
00:26:50
Saikat Pyne: is following them for a very specific reason.
00:26:53
Saikat Pyne: And just that bond exists basically
00:26:57
Saikat Pyne: OK, so we are about at the end of the show.
00:27:00
Saikat Pyne: Hemani rehab time really has flown past last question to
00:27:05
Saikat Pyne: each of you. If you had one advice to give, uh,
00:27:08
Saikat Pyne: to an emerging creator a micro influencer what it should
00:27:12
Saikat Pyne: be him
00:27:15
Saikat Pyne: did your friend New creators.
00:27:20
Saikat Pyne: That's always gonna be my advice. Utilise the tools given
00:27:23
Saikat Pyne: to you to be able to make better decisions on
00:27:26
Saikat Pyne: what's working, what's not, and find that niche that works
00:27:30
Saikat Pyne: for you as a content creator and stick to it.
00:27:33
Saikat Pyne: Lovely, Lovely data is your friend. What about you reap?
00:27:37
Rishabh Nahar: Well, I actually very much agree with her money, but
00:27:39
Rishabh Nahar: because she's already said that I'm gonna give a different answer,
00:27:42
Rishabh Nahar: and that's literally going to be find your own voice.
00:27:46
Rishabh Nahar: Once you found your voice, just run with it money
00:27:50
Rishabh Nahar: brand manager deal. All of that will follow. But once
00:27:54
Rishabh Nahar: you find you want to find your authentic voice, that's
00:27:58
Rishabh Nahar: the biggest superpower of a creator and everything else will
00:28:01
Rishabh Nahar: fall in place.
00:28:02
Saikat Pyne: Lovely. And on that insight foot note, it's a rap.
00:28:07
Saikat Pyne: Thank you so much for being on the podcast. Hemani
00:28:09
Saikat Pyne: and Rasha really appreciated you. Taking time out.
00:28:11
Rishabh Nahar: Of course. Thank you so much for having us. Thanks,
00:28:14
Saikat Pyne: guys. Please do tune in next week for the next
00:28:18
Saikat Pyne: episode of the U Incorporated podcast. See ya.
00:28:27
Saikat Pyne: Thank you for tuning into the you incorporated podcast with me.
00:28:32
Saikat Pyne: Please follow trade and review us on Spotify and apple
00:28:37
Saikat Pyne: podcasts and share our episodes far and wide.
00:28:42
Saikat Pyne: You can also sign up for our free you incorporated
00:28:45
Saikat Pyne: newsletter on our website the you ink dot Co and
00:28:50
Saikat Pyne: send us your suggestions at high at the rate the
00:28:53
Saikat Pyne: you ink dot com We have all the links in
00:28:57
Saikat Pyne: our show logs catch you in the next episode