Interview With "The First Omen" Director Arkasha Stevenson & Writer Tim Smith

[00:00:00] You are listening to the Next Best Picture Podcast and this is Cody Darrocks interview with the director and writer for the first omen,

[00:00:07] Arkasha Stevenson and the co-writer Tim Smith.

[00:00:30] There's this girl at the orphanage. I think that she really needs someone to look out for her.

[00:00:41] Carlito.

[00:00:43] Suffers from a touch of madness.

[00:00:47] You must be very careful, Margaret.

[00:00:52] Bad things will start to happen around her. Evil things.

[00:00:56] It's all for you. No, don't.

[00:01:00] Hello, this is Cody Darrocks with Next Best Picture and I'm so happy to be here talking with the creative team behind the new film, The First Omen.

[00:01:09] Joining me today are director Arkasha Stevenson and writer Tim Smith. Thank you both so much for being here with me today.

[00:01:16] Thanks for having us.

[00:01:18] Of course. I have to say, The First Omen, I saw it last night. It really impressed me.

[00:01:23] I am a huge horror buff and some of the frightening images you put on that screen and the feeling of dread you managed to shroud the entire movie and it just really got to me.

[00:01:33] Oh my. Thank you.

[00:01:36] Yeah, and I'm hard to spook. I'm just saying so good work there.

[00:01:39] Yeah, it's great. Thank you.

[00:01:41] Of course. Well, obviously I wanted to start with your connection to the original in 1976 film. So what drew you to that material and made you want to make a prequel?

[00:01:50] Yeah. Well, we, you know, we were huge Omen fans growing up. We both watched it really, really young. And so when we heard that there was going to be a prequel, I think we got, I think we both had a pretty heavy level of skepticism about like why would you make a prequel?

[00:02:08] And what would it be about? And just is it going to earn its place or is it going to be a cash grab? And then we read the script and it was from the point of view of this young woman.

[00:02:20] And I was like, oh gosh, that's so different from what we know, which is a pretty masculine franchise, which is Omen.

[00:02:27] And I think that that really kind of set the tone for the fact that the studio was looking to do something different with this material.

[00:02:38] Yeah, exactly. I mean, the movie is so sacred for us. Ironically, our love for the Omen made us uninterested in doing a prequel because we were so scared to enter that world and to kind of mess with such sacred films.

[00:02:49] So like Kasha said, I think it was only when we realized we were kind of able to tell a different story with the new character and kind of put our stamp on it that we were really excited about it.

[00:02:58] So you both talked about the script was brought to you. Can you tell me about the process of what it was like taking an existing script? And Tim, can you tell me a bit about your input into it?

[00:03:09] Yeah, definitely. I mean, I think that the biggest thing that we latched on to was the character of Margaret and without spoiling too much, you know, I think we wanted to kind of take what happened to her and kind of reconceive all the horror through her subjectivity.

[00:03:23] I think that, you know, the initial script leaned in a lot more to Carlita, you know, as this Damien like child and a lot more kind of religious horror, which frankly just didn't scare us as much and felt like something that was a bit more familiar and something that we would expect out of an Omen prequel.

[00:03:40] And I think trying to kind of anchor it in Margaret's character and her subjectivity and this idea of body horror and kind of centering it around birth just felt like it not only scared us more but felt like it kind of reflected a horror that resonated with the time that we're in right now.

[00:03:55] Yeah, it was almost like far more inspired by repulsion in a way. You know, like this woman who her fear of being raped is causing her to come undone and you know, we're, that's what this movie is about is about this woman being sexually violated.

[00:04:12] Is that a spoiler? That's a spoiler.

[00:04:15] Alert, alert.

[00:04:18] Yeah, it's really interesting. There's so many different types of horror films and we love all different types but it's like, you know, I think we were hesitant to have something that felt like there are horror set pieces that kind of feel fleeting, you know, and kind of leave you and feel pretty disposable and we thought, you know, obviously by anchoring it all in Margaret's character, it could help to build a strong attachment to her and to where it kind of really gets under your skin.

[00:04:40] There's so many of the films, horror films particularly from the 70s were drawn to that they really resonate and kind of stay with you because of your attachment to the character and all the horror kind of stemming from that, from that attachment.

[00:04:53] Yeah, I can tell you that intentionality scene to scene really shines through so I'm glad to hear you say that. Speaking of religious based horror, there's a kind of current seemingly coincidental trend right now to have a lot of devil based horror in theaters.

[00:05:08] Last year we had the Nun 2 and the Exorcist believer and this year right now in theaters we have not just your film but we also have Lay Down with the Devil and Immaculates.

[00:05:17] It really reminds me of the kind of 70s era of Satanic horror. Do you have an idea of what draws audiences to religious based terror in an increasingly secular society? I know your film touches on that a little bit so I think I might have some ideas about that.

[00:05:32] Yeah, we actually talked about this a lot when we were writing because I think we're looking at why the Omen was made originally not just the Omen but the films around it right.

[00:05:43] And I think everybody had something collective to say during that time which is all these movies we're talking about demonic children like people are terrified of their children and kind of the violence that's coming out of this intergenerational cultural warfare.

[00:05:57] And I think that people very clearly have something that they're afraid of and want to talk about right now. And for me, I think that's a lot about body politics. You know, I think that it's really interesting that all these movies are coming out within, you know, a year or two of the

[00:06:14] Dobs decision whether or not I think we realize it. I think story horror stories about nuns have to do with sexual repression and and kind of body shame.

[00:06:25] And, and it's all couched within religious war, which I think really is such a potent subgenre and horror just because it really minds at the core of like our relationship to good and evil which has to do with our relationship to ourselves in each other.

[00:06:39] I think far more than any other subgenre. So it just feels like people really want to be talking about something right now, you know, and did that make sense.

[00:06:48] Yeah, totally. Yeah. And it's funny. I mean, I think honestly, like you said the Catholic Church doesn't wield the same influence it did in 76. And because of that, I think we really did use the church and the conspiracy within the church and the film as a way of talking about so many

[00:07:04] other things that are really important to us. You know, it really is just about we've talked a lot about like institutions and power and you know how they cling to that power when they're under threat.

[00:07:13] And I think you can kind of apply that across all different types of groups right now and like Kasha said body politics and all different types of themes that really the Catholic Church in this film kind of felt like the perfect way to address that

[00:07:26] to get a little personal feel free to skip this if you don't want to but did either of you have any specific religious upbringings that informed the film for you as you were making it.

[00:07:34] Yeah, it's interesting. You know, I grew up a Catholic and even went to Catholic school. You know, it's funny I thought about this a lot. And I honestly think the only thing to me is I also grew up in a suburb of Texas.

[00:07:45] And it's like growing up in a suburb of Texas and going to Catholic school I think you're presented almost like an Edward Scissorhands like fashion with a very wholesome facade.

[00:07:55] And I think for somebody like me who loves movies you can't help but wonder what's behind that, and is there even lurking behind it, you kind of get a little paranoid and conspiratorial.

[00:08:04] That's one of the reasons I think we fell in love with the movie like Blue Velvet. It's like you want to find the ear, you know in the grass and the Norman Rockwell s you know Americana sweet town.

[00:08:14] So yeah, it's not like I had anything really beyond that. I think there was just this kind of inherent suspicion that from a storytelling standpoint felt really really appealing to dive into.

[00:08:23] And I mean when you go to Rome, you just see the Catholic Church is this awe inspiring force. And you know it's so powerful and you're really drawn into it.

[00:08:33] And you kind of understand its power and you know so you're really taken by it. So I think from a storytelling standpoint it is really really enticing to explore the evil kind of lurking behind that.

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[00:09:55] I want to talk a bit about the actual shooting of the film. This is a gorgeous looking movie. There is an incredible ease of lighting throughout which as somebody who bemoans how dark and just shrouded in darkness so many modern movies are.

[00:10:10] This was very refreshing so on a personal level thank you for that. The first element is currently screening in certain cities on 35mm which I love to see is a huge fan of celluloid and traditional projection.

[00:10:22] Were you able to shoot on film as well?

[00:10:27] We set a bummer and we specifically wanted to shoot on the 54-52 or is it 52-54 Eastman stock.

[00:10:38] I'm probably mixing the numbers up but it's that one that was everything from 1969-1973 shot on it.

[00:10:48] It's Barry Linden and Chinatown and the Godfather.

[00:10:51] Jaws, Witch Cassidy, it's like the glory film stock.

[00:10:57] That's what we tried to emulate. The film is fairly low contrast for a horror film like what you just pointed out.

[00:11:09] Most horror films are totally black and I think we have a lot of pastel shades in there which I really like so much because it does feel like Aaron Morton was our DP and I think he did do such a painterly job with everything.

[00:11:25] But then we did get to scan to film which was so thrilling. I've never done that before and so it was a really thrilling process and you can really feel the difference when you see the 35mm.

[00:11:38] Yeah, it's really exciting too though in the DI for the digital version like Kasha said they created a LUT to approximate this film stock to really kind of embody the feeling of it and we were always lighting it and shooting it with an eye towards it approximating that film look from the 70s.

[00:11:53] And then in the DI we did a lot of different things including putting grain into the image they called live grain which is basically meant to directly approximate a specific film grain from that error.

[00:12:07] And then so it's really cool I mean we actually have been able to watch, we did all of this in the DI and then we did the film print and on the film print we removed all those effects.

[00:12:16] And it's really interesting to watch them side by side because I think the digital version actually does embody a film look as closely as you can without it being filmed there's no substitute for film but it's been really really fun to see them side by side so hopefully when people see it in a digital format they'll still get that film look quality.

[00:12:33] Yeah the reason I asked if he I saw it in digital and my screening and I wasn't you know I knew they were screening M 35 and I wasn't able to tell if it was actually filmed or not so the illusion works.

[00:12:46] We have guys to follow the choices.

[00:12:48] Thank you.

[00:12:49] Yeah, it's really gorgeous film so thank you.

[00:12:54] I want to talk about your lead actress now Tiger free and this is her first big movie role outside of her television work she is fantastic in the film and like you alluded to with the movie really centers around her the entire time.

[00:13:07] How did you find her was there an audition process and what was it like working with her.

[00:13:11] I mean it's going to sound very Mr Rogers but it was quite literally a dream working with her and I joke that she makes directors lazy because she just has such perfect instincts and doesn't you know, she just throws herself in there pretty deep without.

[00:13:27] She doesn't need help, you know, and it's it's really fantastic and then on top of that she's just like a genuinely beautiful lovely person.

[00:13:35] But we watch servant we were fans of her and servant. Yeah, you're like it's now.

[00:13:41] Yeah, yeah it was pretty wild to me we got flown out to Rome, we basically got told we got green lit for the project right away without much warning and said you're going to Rome.

[00:13:50] And we watched servant on the plane ride we got out saying that's it's now for sure.

[00:13:56] And then we got to meet her over zoom and she took on two of the hardest scenes in the entire film, you know incredibly emotionally devastating scenes.

[00:14:04] And it was eerie she just did it, you know in the blink of an eye she just went right into it did an incredible job went right out of it so we knew right away it was her.

[00:14:11] And it's it's a role like you said it requires so much stamina because she's there every day. It's such a physically and emotionally taxing role so the movie really really rests on her shoulders and she was so incredible or so like it ever.

[00:14:26] Yeah, every every day it was so we were actually laughing that well this this isn't funny. We were joking like oh how are we going to torture you today, you know, and but she was amazing because she was she would go from one thing to

[00:14:39] another, and she would always be smiling like we just had to throw her into the into the riot and then immediately that later that day she's at the disco you know and she's hanging upside down or yeah with a strobe light interface and she's just like hello you know just just like sorry I we could

[00:14:57] literally talk for hours about how wonderful she is. You alluded to one very specific scene I think I know which one you're talking about throughout the film there are clear welcome images to some classic horror films possession for as Mary's baby.

[00:15:12] Are there any other horror movies that are favorite series that inspired you throughout the process.

[00:15:17] Quite a lot. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Well yeah here we'll take turns. But I think you know structurally and in for pacing and for character. I don't know if you would typically turn to this as a horror film but I think it is is the Alan Bacoula film

[00:15:34] that I was introduced to it under, you know, somebody said do you want to go see this psychological thriller about a serial killer who's murdering prostitutes and I was like yes of course.

[00:15:45] And, and then lo and behold it's Jane what I think is Jane found his best performance one of the best performance ever.

[00:15:53] And this is actually just this character study of this very complex and very interesting woman. And you really delve into her internal landscape and we were talking like man you really care about her it's very much like the woman because you are embedded in

[00:16:10] characters so so early on. So that was something that we we look to a lot, just as a north star and then what else would you say yeah this is a deep cut but there's this movie from 1932 called vampire.

[00:16:22] By Carl Dreyer that we're absolutely obsessed with. And strangely enough, there's this one moment in the birthing clinic when the woman who's on the gurney your eyes are traveling as if she's seeing something kind of following her across the ceiling that was a direct

[00:16:38] ripoff of vampire. We watched that film more than any other film while we were writing. So that was a huge inspiration. Yeah, we love that movie. It was amazing it's like we saw that movie and and we're like,

[00:16:51] this is this is it. You know, it kind of cracked it a little bit. Yeah, there's countless others we can probably fill the entire time talking about movies that let us you know it's funny because Clute came out in 71 which is the year your film takes place and so there's a world where maybe not these characters but some of the characters

[00:17:08] in the film could have hypothetically seen the film. Yeah, definitely. Strangely enough, even that disco scene we're really kind of trying to channel Clute so yeah, it's interesting to think about that.

[00:17:19] Awesome. Well, this has been great but unfortunately I have to start wrapping up before I let you go I just want to quickly ask do you have any upcoming projects that you're currently working on that you can share?

[00:17:27] We can tell you that it's definitely horror.

[00:17:30] Horror is our life.

[00:17:32] Happy to hear it.

[00:17:34] Our psychic space. Yeah. So yeah.

[00:17:38] Yeah, we keep saying we've been trapped in a dark room for a year and a half so we're trying to figure out the next thing but we've got a couple things that we're very excited about that are very much in the horror realm.

[00:17:47] Hopefully not trapped in the bad room. Let me just say that. No, exactly. Just the private room.

[00:17:52] It's the private room.

[00:17:55] The bad room.

[00:17:59] Well, I'll definitely be keeping an eye out for whatever you have next and again anybody listening if you don't have an idea when you're going to see the first Omen please prioritize this. This is a great film and thank you so much for joining me today.

[00:18:12] Thank you.

[00:18:42] I appreciate your feedback and your support which you can also lend on over at Patreon for $1 minimum on love to get some exclusive podcast content from us. Thank you all so much for listening as always and we will see you all next time.

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