"Imaginary"

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[00:00:30] You were listening to the Next Best Picture Podcast and this is our review of imaginary.

[00:00:36] How does it feel being back?

[00:00:38] Good. I had such good memories here. Maybe my happy place can be our happy place.

[00:00:43] We left you alone alone down here.

[00:00:46] It was just my mind.

[00:00:48] I'm playing a new game with Chonzie.

[00:00:51] The scavenger hunt was that's fun.

[00:00:53] Chonzie says you're not allowed to play with us.

[00:00:56] Oh. Because you left him.

[00:00:58] I mean something happy.

[00:01:00] Something happy.

[00:01:02] Ugh, that bugs treat you out.

[00:01:05] If I can finish my list, Chonzie will take me on a trip to the place he's from.

[00:01:15] Something that hurts.

[00:01:17] Oh, it's...

[00:01:19] All right, everybody. You just listening to the trailer for imaginary and the story is as follows.

[00:01:26] When Jessica moves back into her childhood home with her family,

[00:01:29] her youngest stepdaughter Alice develops an eerie attachment to a stuffed bear named Chonzie.

[00:01:34] She finds in the basement.

[00:01:36] Alice starts playing games with Chonzie that begin playful and become increasingly sinister.

[00:01:42] As Alice's behavior becomes more and more concerning,

[00:01:45] Jessica intervenes only to realize Chonzie is much more than the stuffed toy bear she believed him to be.

[00:01:53] The film is starring D1DWYZ, Tom Payne, Tegan Burns, Piper Braun, Veronica Falcon,

[00:02:01] and Betty Buckley.

[00:02:02] It is directed and written by Jeff Wadlow and co-written by Greg Urban and Jason Ormland.

[00:02:09] Here to join me today for this podcast review I have at Assasic.

[00:02:13] Hello.

[00:02:14] Danilo Castro.

[00:02:16] Everybody. Cody Derrick's.

[00:02:19] Imagine there's no Chonzie.

[00:02:23] And Josh Paarum.

[00:02:25] Hello, hello.

[00:02:26] All right, so I guess we'll go around the horn first and we will ask everyone

[00:02:30] who is your imaginary friend growing up starting with Emma?

[00:02:34] Well, that's great. It's a really nice therapy session that we're about to enter into.

[00:02:38] Because none of them are going to be as fucked up as this.

[00:02:41] Yes, I don't think I really had an imaginary friend.

[00:02:45] I had all of my barbies and so I would play with them.

[00:02:49] But every toy that I had was more physical, like an actual physical being.

[00:02:53] So I don't recall there being a little Chonzie telling me to stab myself with scissors

[00:02:59] or to co-light something on fire, thankfully.

[00:03:03] Danilo, what about you?

[00:03:05] No imaginary friends.

[00:03:06] I did have a teddy bear named Max.

[00:03:09] But he kind of like him, he didn't really prompt me to do anything like criminal.

[00:03:13] So it's less exciting than this.

[00:03:15] Why Max?

[00:03:16] I don't know. That's a good question.

[00:03:18] I think I just decided on Max.

[00:03:19] I was like, this bear seems like a Max.

[00:03:21] All right, Josh, what about you?

[00:03:23] Yeah, and a similar boat.

[00:03:24] I don't know if I had like an actual imaginary friend,

[00:03:27] but I do have a very distinct memory of

[00:03:30] a little jafar from a Latin toy that I would obsessively play with

[00:03:34] and act out scenes of the movie.

[00:03:36] So I had a very strong kinship to that character.

[00:03:38] No.

[00:03:39] That's exactly how Josh, yeah, I know.

[00:03:43] Cody?

[00:03:44] So maybe unsurprising to anybody who's ever spoken to me,

[00:03:46] but I was a very percusious, aware child.

[00:03:49] And so I didn't have an imaginary friend because I felt it was childish

[00:03:52] and unrealistic, which is hilarious when you're five years old.

[00:03:55] But that's me.

[00:03:57] Cody was 35 years old when he was five years old.

[00:04:01] Actually, I mean, I was a very well-served boy's child.

[00:04:04] If anybody has ever seen that as a male sketch,

[00:04:06] it's for a lot about me.

[00:04:08] I had a vintage gunned bear that I called

[00:04:16] gunned because of the tag.

[00:04:19] And we would vanquish enemies together and he was the most badass teddy bear

[00:04:25] you could possibly imagine.

[00:04:27] So in the lead up here to talking about imaginary

[00:04:32] uh, yeah.

[00:04:33] As Emma said, none of these imaginary friends manifested themselves into evil nightmarish

[00:04:41] beings that would tell us to hurt ourselves or hurt others.

[00:04:44] And that's essentially what the concept of imaginary is presenting here is,

[00:04:48] oh, what if the imaginary friend that you had was something or someone that was trying to do

[00:04:54] you or people you loved harm?

[00:04:56] And of course, it's a little bit more than that as we get into the characters and their backstory.

[00:05:03] And guys, I gotta be honest with you, like I'm trying to make this sound somewhat professional,

[00:05:08] but in all honesty, this is not a good movie.

[00:05:12] This is a pretty, pretty poor horror film from Blum House.

[00:05:16] So going around the horn once again, what did you all think of imaginary?

[00:05:21] I will start us off with Cody Derrick's.

[00:05:23] Cody, you wrote the review on the website.

[00:05:25] And you're our horror expert.

[00:05:28] Did this do anything for you?

[00:05:31] It did things for me, but not what the film probably intended.

[00:05:35] So, you know, I have a lot of admiration for Blum House, especially their business model,

[00:05:39] which allows smaller, low-budget horror films from

[00:05:43] usually newer directors to get released under their umbrella and inevitably see a significant profit.

[00:05:48] I really appreciate that.

[00:05:50] But imaginary represents a lot of the studio's worst tendencies.

[00:05:54] It's a PG-13 film that's pretty toothless,

[00:05:57] birthed from a truly confounding, often contradictory screenplay.

[00:06:01] I'm sure we'll get into some of the things this screenplay backs.

[00:06:06] It really conjures up a lot.

[00:06:07] It's very confusing and odd at times and not intentionally.

[00:06:11] And PG-13 horror movies have the capacity to be good and even scary.

[00:06:15] I'm thinking of something as foundational to me as a horror addict

[00:06:19] as the English remake of The Ring or even something as terrifying as the upcoming

[00:06:24] I Saw The TV Glow, which is PG-13 kind of surprisingly.

[00:06:27] But features some of the most unsettling moments I can see in recent memory.

[00:06:31] But imaginary is just sloppily made and just really not very scary outside of a small handful

[00:06:38] of Starling images and just okay jump scares.

[00:06:42] All right. I'm a sassy. What about you?

[00:06:44] What did you think? Well, I think it's really funny that in 2024 we are getting two vastly

[00:06:50] different films about imaginary friends. One is this the other one is if by John Kuzinski.

[00:06:56] No joke. I legitimately thought they were to say movie for a while.

[00:06:59] Me too. Me too.

[00:07:00] I'm confused in terms of like I don't know which one I'm about to go into so let's see.

[00:07:08] Yeah, this film, I mean from the Gico, like how it starts off, I was so underwhelmed

[00:07:13] in terms of what should be like a high pace, high stress environment.

[00:07:19] And just the entire time I just found myself sying and like feeling so exhausted watching

[00:07:26] this family navigate one family relationship issues and so many different little bits of drama

[00:07:33] amongst themselves all for it to culminate into this imaginary bear stuffed animal blur.

[00:07:42] And it was just just so much going on and a lot of it felt very mismatched slash nobody really

[00:07:51] wanted to be there. You could just tell the people were phoning it in for this film as usual.

[00:07:57] We've got some weird annoying kids in a film like this which doesn't necessarily always help

[00:08:04] some moments were fine, but yeah, it was just the most.

[00:08:08] All right, let's get through it film in recent memory.

[00:08:12] Yeah, yeah, I definitely feel that Danilo, what about you? Same thoughts?

[00:08:17] Yeah, I'm echoing a lot of what's been said here already. It's it's uh

[00:08:22] it has a decent enough premise and you know this can definitely be executed in a way that's

[00:08:26] entertaining or ridiculous to the point of being like unexpected but they do kind of take the

[00:08:33] most generic streamlined sort of uninspired approach that they can to the material.

[00:08:40] I was reminded like repeatedly throughout the movie like any sort of direction that the story

[00:08:45] took. It was like oh it's like this film only sort of an inferior version or oh now they're

[00:08:49] trying to pull from this film only and it's you know, it's an inferior version so

[00:08:54] I've no problem with genre movies especially pulling from you know other sources as sort of

[00:09:01] a jumping off point but when it's just consistently done to a worst degree it does sort of add up

[00:09:08] but the time I got to the end of this movie is like okay I mean what are we what are we doing here

[00:09:12] you know yeah it's just they they they could have just uh just done something a lot more

[00:09:17] exciting what they did. I don't mean to reiterate already but we'll get into some of the more

[00:09:21] specifics I'm sure as we as we go on here this is uh this is a miss. All right and Josh Parm.

[00:09:27] Yeah, a lot of this movie just feels so like perfunctory to me it just is the minimal amount

[00:09:34] of effort for this kind of a story and this kind of a movie and it doesn't really do anything

[00:09:41] that I found to be very inventive in its storytelling or or in its execution. It just felt like

[00:09:47] the type of movie you would expect this to be coming out around the time that it is. It's like yeah

[00:09:52] this is what I kind of imagined it being and honestly it doesn't make it like an all-out terrible

[00:09:59] film it's not like I would say this is one of the worst movies I've ever seen but it does make it

[00:10:03] really really uninspired. It it takes routes that you have seen in many horror movies with this sort

[00:10:10] of similar premise before and even when it has the opportunity to be a little bit more creative

[00:10:15] especially towards the end and kind of the environment that it's in I found even that section to be

[00:10:22] very underwhelming in terms of its design and its own you know imagination if you were to say so

[00:10:30] yeah it's a very uninspired movie I don't really feel like it does anything that really elicits

[00:10:36] a strong emotion honestly either one way or another it's just so bland and generic that

[00:10:43] even the few occasions where it kind of wants to do something more interesting it kind of fumbles

[00:10:47] the ball at that so it's it's pretty forgettable and not really all that engaging to watch either.

[00:10:55] I should have known when I saw that this was being directed by Jeff Wadlow but I was in for

[00:11:02] well let's just say I was in for it because I have not really enjoyed his previous work

[00:11:09] prior to this and so I didn't really have the highest of expectations on top of that I remember

[00:11:15] watching the trailer and I remember that it had this one really good jump scare which involved a

[00:11:22] hallway and the bear basically morphing into like a more nightmarish version of what you would

[00:11:28] expect to see in a movie like this watching the movie itself though is an exercise in how far

[00:11:36] can we push Matt to the point that he might want to walk out of this movie because for the love

[00:11:42] of God I feel like this film was just constantly teasing and teasing and teasing without actually

[00:11:51] doing anything and then by the time it actually did do something where we got to that scene in

[00:11:55] the trailer that I described it was so underwhelming I completely agree with that sentiment it was so

[00:12:02] so so underwhelming I was never once well actually no that's a lie I would argue that maybe one

[00:12:08] or two jump scares got me pretty good but one thing I keep coming back to is I didn't know exactly

[00:12:14] what this film wanted to be in terms of its identity does it want to be a camp fun horror movie the

[00:12:22] way that Megan presented itself does it want to be genuinely terrifying is it trying to actually

[00:12:29] elicit some form of laughter from how terribly atrocious the dialogue is in this screenplay

[00:12:36] I just couldn't tell what the actual intent was here and that drove me crazy and I kept

[00:12:44] totally out hope that it was gonna get better it was going to get more bonkers or it was going

[00:12:48] to get scarier oh my god I felt like the ending of this movie was just disappointing and I'm happy

[00:12:58] to get into specifics spoilers be damned because I really don't want to dance around why I thought

[00:13:07] that the ending was so underwhelming but overall this movie is something that I just feel

[00:13:15] squandered a tremendous amount of potential with its premise and you know that goes back to what we

[00:13:20] were saying before about like our own imaginary friends in life if you take that childhood idea

[00:13:27] and you turn it into something that could fit into a horror movie I actually do think that the idea

[00:13:31] itself is pretty good like as an elevator pitch for a movie to make on a low budget it's not a

[00:13:38] bad idea it was just the execution I thought was very very very off this even needed to be a hard

[00:13:47] r on the level of something like it or it needed to be something way more fun and not so serious

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[00:14:29] right and when it gets to where it's going it kind of feels like it might be leaning towards a

[00:14:34] perspective that your point is more fun or outrageous but it hasn't done the work to get to

[00:14:40] that point yet and you know I look at this it has three as three writers on the screen play

[00:14:45] the movie as a whole kind of felt like and I don't usually say this as a critique because

[00:14:49] I don't really hold this against movies very much but it felt very chopped up in like the editing

[00:14:54] bay like there was a lot of nonsensical match cuts and again contradictory images and even lines

[00:15:02] of dialogue that made me think this movie just felt very unpolished and speaking to those last

[00:15:08] like 10 minutes Matt like you said I even like I fell for the twist like this not twist for the trick

[00:15:16] of the fake out ending and I just fully rolled up my seats my recliner theater scene was ready to

[00:15:21] bolt out there and then there was another like 10 minutes and it was just really unnecessary and

[00:15:26] not shocking just kind of deflating at that point. The ending to this movie yeah when

[00:15:33] you get to that part especially it you already feel like something's about to happen and not

[00:15:38] really because you are expecting it I think it's more so just because it's so horribly shot

[00:15:45] and executed that you just feel like something is off just because of that and I think that is

[00:15:51] very indicative of a lot of the decisions that go on in this movie that it it just feels as you

[00:15:57] said yeah so unpolished it feels like they took the first draft of this screen playing just that

[00:16:01] that's good we'll run with that and and the creativity stopped there yeah when everything like

[00:16:08] quote unquote changes when you're like oh psych it was the most lazyist's psych out moment

[00:16:16] and I truly was like you know what we were really close to ending this you could have just

[00:16:22] ended it it did not need to be at all like this yeah I was really really hoping that we were

[00:16:29] going to get like a clue like ending like I was like give me multiple fake out endings please

[00:16:35] just like toy around with me have fun because by that point the movie I was just begging it to do

[00:16:41] something instead of making me feel like oh my god get me out of here I want to go home yeah it's

[00:16:46] to that point about like you sort of compared it to sort of a Megan in like a different tonality

[00:16:51] kind of sense it's like if it had leaned into sort of a more absurd thing you could have

[00:16:57] you could have gone similar directions and made it entertain but they take it so serious in such a

[00:17:02] such a joyless way that it's like come on are you really you're really trying to go here you know

[00:17:07] like you just you don't want to give it the benefit of it doubt because it's so uninspired in that way

[00:17:11] they really really really thought they were saying something when they were including references to

[00:17:15] Bing Bong from inside out in this screenplay and all they were doing instead was making me go

[00:17:21] fuck I want to go watch that instead I'd rather watch that yeah why do they have to mention

[00:17:27] they kept mentioning that at least 10 times in this film and I was like okay we got the rights

[00:17:33] from Pixar I guess to save this I didn't even know Bing Bong had that much of a cultural impact

[00:17:38] that it could make its way into a movie like this to be fair I do constantly think about Bing Bong

[00:17:45] and how that scene wrecked me a few years ago and I recently rewatched it so I will give them

[00:17:50] that my thinking with all the Bing Bong nonsense which really does get like yeah three or four

[00:17:57] call outs across this movie which is odd and with different tones every time it's always like funny

[00:18:03] is that it points to who this movie is aiming towards because you got a figure that movie is

[00:18:07] almost 10 years old this is a PG 13 horror movie a lot of kids probably grew up with that movie

[00:18:12] as a point of reference and now to watch this horror movie if they're old enough to do so that's

[00:18:17] a good way for them to know what the film is talking about but totally it's just ridiculous and

[00:18:23] points to kind of like the perspective of the screenplay being a skew the entire time I mean this movie

[00:18:28] ultimately wants to also be a story about a woman Jessica here played by Dewanda Wise who

[00:18:36] it like is struggling to be this stepmother and is reconciling her own childhood trauma and at a

[00:18:45] certain point I was like you know I get that horror has to have these underlying meanings to them

[00:18:52] but you guys are laying it on way too thick and heavy and you just haven't earned the right

[00:18:57] to give me a meaningful story that's worth caring about when everything else surrounding it is not

[00:19:01] as effective as it should be and I just wish you could have not taken itself so seriously

[00:19:07] and really just revel in the bonkers nature of the promise that the

[00:19:14] conceited this movie held because I really do think that this type of premise lends itself well

[00:19:20] to creativity and you know no pun intended imagination and that wasn't on display here instead

[00:19:27] what we got were CGI shots of Ted

[00:19:35] I just kept thinking this is like if Ted just like started murdering people

[00:19:40] yeah I would have like because you I guess when you are a kid and your imagination runs wild

[00:19:46] like I would have loved to have seen I don't know this bear like shapeshift into like so many

[00:19:51] different little terrifying creatures or like you know like people thinking that they're seeing

[00:19:58] you know a bunch of crazy stuff all around them and it's it's usually just in the form of this bear

[00:20:04] which yes the bear the bear's eyes are a bit unsettling in this but I can't say that he's like

[00:20:11] the most terrifying looking like doll that a child would play with I had some very creepy

[00:20:18] little porcelain dolls at home so they beat this thing and yeah like you don't see them like

[00:20:25] utilizing the physics of imagination until all the way at the end when they're like doing

[00:20:32] the door thing because I was like yeah why was this missing throughout this entire film like

[00:20:38] obviously you can do that in this in this this is a one instance where you can do stupid things

[00:20:44] like this why are we not utilizing this more right they like some of me when I said like they tease

[00:20:49] and waited too long to reveal it that by the time they did it's like you've already lost me like

[00:20:53] if you would have revealed this earlier in the movie and had it shapeshift like kind of like

[00:20:58] I was saying like it you know that's something that I think could have been so much more effective

[00:21:02] it probably would have gotten called out for being this is this is not as good as that but at the same

[00:21:07] time at least it would have been more dynamic and engaging by the time like we got to the third act

[00:21:14] we had seen what chauncy really was like the first time it reveals itself I was like holy shit

[00:21:21] like that's really cool like that's a great design and that was really effective but after you've

[00:21:26] seen it a couple of times and they linger on shots of him and stuff it's like it stopped being scary

[00:21:31] yeah I mean we see a few shots of him throughout the film too like in the background or behind

[00:21:36] another character and I don't hate that intention that's always kind of my favorite scares when

[00:21:42] something is kind of in the background and isn't highlighted explicitly so no the best example

[00:21:46] that was the one in the bed at nighttime where he was at the edge of the bed yes yes that was

[00:21:52] really good that got me and you know but the another problem is this movie is shot so dark

[00:21:58] that there were times where I was like I think I can see what I'm supposed to be seeing but I can't

[00:22:02] see it so what are we doing here and to point out once we saw the design of like what chauncy's true

[00:22:07] form is similar to Pennywise in it's is kind of uninspired you know it's a little eerie but it's not

[00:22:14] it just kind of looks like the alien from asteroid city actually and I wasn't really quite sure what

[00:22:19] we were going for at that point because it wasn't scary well we also saw it at the very beginning of

[00:22:24] the movie like how couldn't believe that like you showed the true identity of this creature like

[00:22:30] in frame one you have broken the cardinal rule of a horror movie which is to hold back your monster

[00:22:36] until the end and wasn't that um supposed to be her spider creation in the beginning or did I

[00:22:41] just completely miss chauncy yeah but like like that's the many forms of this all I see you say it

[00:22:47] yeah and it manifests as that spider creature in her dream at the beginning but it also looks like

[00:22:52] that at the end of the movie and so just even like the finale I found to be so badly executed like

[00:22:58] we go into this imagination world where like literally anything can happen and it's like oh it's

[00:23:05] it's the esher drawing come to line okay I've seen that before it's so it's so like weak sauce

[00:23:12] you know when we get to the end you know when you do like one of those like haunted house like

[00:23:17] walkthroughs or not even like a haunted house but like a like a hall of mirrors or something

[00:23:23] like really cheesy like that this this from a production design standpoint just gave me

[00:23:29] this feeling of wow this really feels like it's being made for kids with very very minimal effort

[00:23:36] put into actually making this unsettling and spooky like I felt like I was watching almost um

[00:23:41] those old television episodes of goosebumps yeah sure it's almost like they're like you said

[00:23:47] there was already like stock scary without putting any sort of embellishment on it

[00:23:51] it looks just like that one painting or print with like all of those staircases that are like

[00:23:58] just kind of going around in circles and things are not actually going where you need them to go

[00:24:03] and I don't know if that's the most scary thing that you could possibly think of in like an imaginary

[00:24:10] land where again anything is open to you and everything is basically on the table but yeah it was a

[00:24:17] very lazy design um especially since wow you can go into this door or that door it's like wow okay

[00:24:28] I mean I also don't know too like what in what world do you think you're going to be able to

[00:24:32] create something that's going to wow an audience with a plum house level budget like

[00:24:38] plum houses way more effective when you lean into um I know Cody you said this like booze really

[00:24:44] dark but like imagine if the imaginary world was pitch black with glimmers of something you know

[00:24:53] emerging from the darkness that would be like more terrifying and that's like what your imagination

[00:24:57] is conjuring in those moments I don't know like I just kept thinking there's got to be a better

[00:25:01] way to present this in a way that could have been more scary yeah I guess but at that point the film

[00:25:06] I probably would be like oh they turned out in money you know because like when they went into the

[00:25:10] imaginary world I was a little bit surprised that there was something that was like clearly a set

[00:25:14] they had to build and yes it was poorly executed it just kind of reminded me of like

[00:25:19] as I may hear ever seen hellbound hellraiser 2 oh my god yeah the design of this kind of looks like

[00:25:26] again like hell junior you know where it's like oh I see MC Escher and oh there's clouds with

[00:25:33] thunder claps going it just was very first thought not best thought yeah but uh hellraiser had

[00:25:38] better matte painting so like well yes at least you got that this one is just oh it's so

[00:25:45] bland and so like generic looking and even when we then got more of this creature like

[00:25:53] I will give them this they clearly built a suit they built multiple suits and I will at least give

[00:25:57] them credit for that I'm glad we saw a physical creature interacting with the actors but it is so

[00:26:04] poorly shot and poorly kind of just designed even in general that it never for once did it not

[00:26:11] look like a guy in a suit and that also just completely dissipated any movie magic and be getting

[00:26:17] scared by this sequence because even though I appreciated the physicality of it the execution was

[00:26:22] just really really poor in showing this and was not scary at all. DeWanda Weiss is someone who

[00:26:30] is on the Netflix show or was on the Netflix show sorry it's no longer on anymore she's got to have

[00:26:36] it and she's been getting film roles like here and there mostly does television work

[00:26:42] of in the most part she's going to be an out of coming show three women pretty soon and I did think

[00:26:48] that they're like to give some credit if I if I can I actually did feel that she was doing the

[00:26:54] best that she could with the material that she was given to chart the emotions of that character

[00:27:00] and you know get us invested in what she was going through as this new not so much like new mom but

[00:27:08] someone who's really struggling to assimilate herself into that role and for like I'm listening

[00:27:18] I'm not saying it's great but I thought out of all the performances in this movie which I really

[00:27:23] thought across the board were terrible because of the dialogue that they were given she made the

[00:27:28] most of it and I thought she walked away the most unscathed from it. I would agree I mean

[00:27:34] I forget who said it earlier regarding the script but this does feel like one of the most like

[00:27:39] obligatory dramatic storylines in a horror movie that I've seen in a while it's like well we need to

[00:27:45] have one of these and the dialogue everything just feels so like okay you're supposed to have

[00:27:51] something along the lines of this and it's the most just boilerplate version of it. I agree she

[00:27:57] does the best job of like carrying it off but that's that's tough you know it's a tough job it's a

[00:28:02] thinkless job. Piper Braun who plays Alice in this movie has like the most cutesy cutesy kid voice

[00:28:11] you could possibly ever imagine. Certunicially so. That's the problem exactly it's it becomes

[00:28:20] so unserious and to me it just felt like they were always constantly having her say lines in a

[00:28:27] way where they just had in mind oh this will work well on a trailer yeah yeah I always feel kind

[00:28:33] of bad for kids in this situation because I blame the director obviously like clearly she was

[00:28:37] directed to have the most you know surely temple Gerber baby line readings when she wasn't

[00:28:44] possessed by this doll and then the most like shining lights you know we watched child's play once

[00:28:51] kind of spooky child line readings when she is possessed and neither works it is just so

[00:28:56] obvious and cliche and again I I lay it at the feet of the director. And then of course the

[00:29:02] teenager character Taylor just the most stereotypical oh I hate my stepmom I hate everything here

[00:29:12] suburbs yeah I hate the suburbs my life is ruined that one scene where they were telling

[00:29:19] um Jessica to make them a sandwich I was like these girls are so rude oh my god and Betty Buckley

[00:29:27] going oh my god I like that yeah okay yeah Betty Buckley I wanted more of her and I wanted more

[00:29:34] weirdness from her because yeah you get it a little bit in that sequence when the little girl comes up

[00:29:39] and she like tells her you know that's very rude and it's like a weird energy she was putting off

[00:29:44] but like when I was like I was so hungry for it's like I want more of that energy in this movie and

[00:29:49] you know Betty Buckley could deliver and they they flirt with it a little bit towards the end

[00:29:54] with like a somewhat twist with that character but it is far too little too late at that point like

[00:29:58] I needed more of whatever she was tapping into to be more present throughout this film. She has one

[00:30:04] really bizarre moment where they're in the dream world and she kind of like it's also like

[00:30:09] the camera does something weird here the camera pulls back above their head and she kind of extends

[00:30:13] her arms and goes it's incredible world of our imagination and I didn't really know what I was

[00:30:19] supposed to do with that and my audience just kind of sat silently which is I think the best thing

[00:30:25] you can do when you don't know what to do. I never think I will give her some credit for here

[00:30:29] is that even though I don't think the filmmakers knew exactly what kind of film they wanted to make

[00:30:34] I do think that just not Jesse Buckley whoa um Betty Buckley had an idea of what kind of a movie she

[00:30:43] was in and just ran with it. I don't know if that lined up with what Jeff Wadlow was doing

[00:30:49] necessarily but I agree Josh like whatever energy she was bringing to it I was like oh she probably

[00:30:56] thinks that she is in one of those camp fun horror movies that's gonna like you know play do

[00:31:02] like a broad audience but it didn't turn out to be that but the energy I felt like she was bringing

[00:31:07] to it certainly matched that because some of the lines that she has to say in terms of just

[00:31:13] exposition I was like she I was like this is so so hilarious to me um and I'm having fun with it

[00:31:22] because it's so terrible and yet I just I don't know there was something about like the way that

[00:31:28] she carried herself throughout this where I did feel like okay I think she's extremely self-aware

[00:31:34] but I don't think her and the director are aligned on that even necessarily. I'm on her side because

[00:31:41] at least she understood like this should be like a funny bad movie and we should all be not

[00:31:49] taking this as seriously as everybody else's and I feel like if they leaned in more with that we

[00:31:56] would have more fun talking about it. I mean because everything like with um you were saying before

[00:32:01] Taylor and who's the idiot hunk next door um of the neighbor kid. Oh my god I I saw into my

[00:32:12] chair so hard during every scene that that boy was a part of I oh yeah cringe there's a moment when

[00:32:20] I could forget who with the character's name that Betty Buckley plays but your first

[00:32:26] or is like old bag something and I remember you in that line it triggered something in me where

[00:32:31] it's like that sounds like a 50 year old remembering old horror movies and how young people reference

[00:32:36] old people that does not happen today so it felt like that character just had no sense of real identity

[00:32:43] it felt like like a caricature of a caricature and just completely empty like the comedy they tried

[00:32:51] to use him for was so terrible the scare sequence that they tried to also build around him was just

[00:32:58] very flat and uninspired everything about that character was terrible and even a Taylor I had to

[00:33:04] tell you my audience when I saw this movie was actively rooting for her to die they hate

[00:33:09] yeah I love that like RIP Taylor during many things they hated her so much oh my god that's amazing

[00:33:22] it was a totally thing about the movie my audience was comatose from start to finish so

[00:33:27] yeah my audience didn't react really to anything even the scenes where like I said there's maybe one

[00:33:34] or two good jumpscares in this and even in those moments I didn't get the sense that my audience was

[00:33:41] gasping or breathing a sigh of relief when the scene was over maybe maybe more so like oh god

[00:33:47] is this almost over and I can get out of here but not in the sense of oh man it was really scary

[00:33:52] you know nothing like that the one of the bedroom I think is the most effective one as we mentioned

[00:33:57] before where you can kind of see a slight movement and then she looks under the bed like

[00:34:01] that to me is the only one that really worked and once again for my audience like there were like

[00:34:06] this row of girls in front of me and they all very loudly screamed at that one so that was

[00:34:11] effective for them but it was about the only one that really was no because everything that we like

[00:34:16] happens in the third act especially is not scary no like at all I do think the teasing moments

[00:34:26] really on in the movie with Chancé can be creepy and effective but the problem is that it drags

[00:34:31] how for far too long before then it finally reveals its true nature maybe the best scene in the

[00:34:39] entire movie for me is the scene that involves Veronica Falcone the pharipist because of a couple

[00:34:50] of reasons here one is I just really really enjoyed watching her on Ozark and I was just happy to see

[00:34:57] her here two there is a line that she asks um that she asks the mother has she taken up any new hobbies

[00:35:06] such as ventriloquism that hadn't been rolling on the floor laughing that means a fire therapist

[00:35:13] if she's asking these questions but then I also thought too that the way that the possession

[00:35:19] was conveyed and how Alice was shown in like through the camcorder I thought all that was really

[00:35:27] really well done but it it unfortunately just isn't enough to obviously sustain an entire movie

[00:35:34] I do love when a child absolutely reads an adult for filth in a horror movie I feel like it happens

[00:35:39] a lot and in this one he was calling the pharipist grandkids ugly which is like okay rude

[00:35:46] also she like among the things where she was saying like oh she I just why would this child

[00:35:53] know about her three grandkids like why was the therapist not more concerned over the fact that

[00:35:59] this girl knew about her personal life like is she just totally like brushed over that fact

[00:36:06] because she was bringing up other things like you know she mentioned this or this reminds me of

[00:36:11] this case I'm like okay but she knows about your family life and that doesn't seem like

[00:36:16] something a five-year-old should know about she did with any sensical person would do which was

[00:36:22] here's the card for her friend I'm getting the hell out of here goodbye no instead she shows

[00:36:29] to the main character she breaks hip evaluations by showing another patient's video

[00:36:35] yeah she had no problem she was just like listen she's like the nanny I sense you're in trouble

[00:36:45] I'm on my way and here's a video and I am out actually you know what the best example of

[00:36:51] that in this movie is actually Tom Payne who plays the husband he was just like I'm gonna go play

[00:36:56] keep up with my band y'all have fun dealing with this murderous bear he just dips the entire movie

[00:37:03] the entire time after he left and we see what happens I was just like what is the conversation

[00:37:10] like between this family when he returns home like how do they explain all of these wounds

[00:37:16] how does he explain the house burning up in flames like what how do you just sit down with him and say

[00:37:23] yeah um there was a murderous bear yeah it was rough babe everything's okay between me my father

[00:37:32] you want to like I'm gonna go read in my story yeah the character yeah the character of the father

[00:37:40] was also just very much like a throwaway and the explanation for why he is the way that he is at

[00:37:48] the end is just just lol it was so manipulative to the point that I no I'm sorry no I needed this

[00:38:00] movie to be darker I needed this movie to one of two things like I said either lean into being

[00:38:06] darker and more serious with like a hard r rating or just do away with all this emotional tug of

[00:38:13] your heartstrings like crap and just have fun with it and go buck wild you know with some of the

[00:38:19] creativity that you can get from a premise like this instead they're trying to like introduce

[00:38:24] like all this family drama and it's like we don't care we're not emotionally invested I'm sorry

[00:38:30] the writing is not there it's not good enough to justify this much focus on it yeah exactly

[00:38:36] all right final thoughts here this is gonna be a short one people I'm sorry like I just don't

[00:38:40] want to come off as repetitious but there's not much to really say here um Emma we're gonna go

[00:38:45] to you any final thoughts you have on imaginary history is complicated the story of human progress

[00:38:56] is long messy and riddled with controversies big and small on conflicted we dive headfirst in

[00:39:03] history's most infamous events and contentious figures we try and untangle the good from the bad

[00:39:10] the fact from the fiction and the monsters from the misunderstood was jingus con a murderous butcher

[00:39:17] or a civic pioneer did the allied powers go too far in fire bombing the german city of

[00:39:23] dresden at the twilight of world war two and how did the marquee decide acquire such a sinister

[00:39:29] reputation and was any of it true these are just a few of the tough questions we wrestle with

[00:39:36] and investigate on conflicted so if you love history or just enjoy a good story please join me

[00:39:43] your host Zach Cornwell for a fascinating new topic each and every month conflicted a history

[00:39:49] podcast is available on Spotify Apple or wherever else you get your podcasts I hope to see you soon

[00:40:07] to be quite honest no like I said I feel like the dad was the best character in this because he got

[00:40:14] the fuck out of there and he didn't have to deal with any of this shit and I would absolutely do

[00:40:18] the same thing so all of my star ratings go to him and his decision and you know what he's

[00:40:25] clearly a rock star like like his five I like his fashion sense oh yeah oh I did not know

[00:40:32] yeah it was like early 2010 oh god no I like it in the sense for how generic it is is what I was

[00:40:40] trying to get ahead but yeah I also like I don't know when this film takes place and I don't care

[00:40:47] enough to realize if it is in the modern day if it's like his fashion sense is giving me like

[00:40:53] 2000's vibes everybody here does not know where technology stands at this point so we're all confused

[00:41:03] all right deniel a Castro well you mentioned the hallway jump scare the one that was like

[00:41:08] featured really heavily in the trailer and that you know that's one of the better ones I can see

[00:41:13] where they put it in the trailer to sort of draw people in but it's just like a blatant ripoff

[00:41:18] what is it shock from the 70s the Mario Boba movie like it's just they just straight up rip that

[00:41:25] setup in terms of like where the camera is the whole execution scene so like even some of the stuff

[00:41:30] that I do think is like decently effective it's just straight up just a lift in from other stuff

[00:41:35] that's better and I think that's sort of indicative of the kind of quality we're dealing with

[00:41:40] so that that's sort of the last little throw-in but yeah I mean everything else I'm going to say

[00:41:45] here's just going to be repetitive all right Josh yeah a couple things actually at the end I will

[00:41:51] say that some of the few effectively like creepy moments that were that I do think work for me is

[00:41:58] that there are some instances where you can actually see that the eyes of the bear changes between

[00:42:04] certain shots in terms of kind of signaling an emotional state that it's in and like it's pretty

[00:42:10] subtle and you may not even notice it at first but that was one decision they made with like okay

[00:42:15] I'll give them credit that's that's actually like something on a subtler side of things that can

[00:42:21] be a bit unsettling and I'll give them that as their most effective form of creating some tension

[00:42:28] or suspense or whatever and and I also even feel like the like the the button eyes that people had

[00:42:34] at the end worked the first time I think when they kept going back to it it wasn't great after that

[00:42:39] but an interesting idea that maybe wasn't fully executed as well as it could be like a lot of

[00:42:46] stuff in this movie even though the button eyes also then reminded me of Coraline so it also

[00:42:51] another thing that it was like ripping off too but it's like an interesting idea not great execution

[00:42:56] all the way through and then the last thing is also in the finale section when they're in the bedroom

[00:43:03] and they have to figure out how to get out and they take everything that's blue and just put it

[00:43:07] on the wall it's a terrible idea it's really dumb and it felt like they're trying to write

[00:43:11] themselves out of a corner but the one thing it did do is that it reminded me of return to Oz

[00:43:18] at the end of that movie they had to find the green things and it's like well congratulations

[00:43:22] you've just now reminded me of another movie I wish I was watching is actually much scarier than

[00:43:26] the movie I'm watching right now but that little moment just reminded me of another film that I

[00:43:30] wanted to mention all right and Cody Derrick's so I didn't really get to talk about the more

[00:43:36] confusing elements of this green play I know I mentioned it like contradicts itself frequently

[00:43:40] I think the most glaring example of this is and I'm not somebody who really cares about like

[00:43:45] plot holes or mistakes or sin sin a mess and you know all this stuff that's become like online

[00:43:51] critique fodder I don't really give a shit but when it distracts me actively during the movie then

[00:43:57] I think it is a problem and the it's established early on that's this is the main character's

[00:44:03] happy place you know they keep talking about this house it's something she has a lot of great memories

[00:44:08] from they usually use the phrase happy place two or three times but at the same time they make it very

[00:44:12] clear that she doesn't have any memories of her childhood she remembers nothing about what happened

[00:44:16] you know in the house all this traumatic stuff also she points out she has five much you moved out

[00:44:21] she doesn't really have any memories so I don't really understand how these two things can be

[00:44:26] can gel together because unless I'm wrong the movie kind of makes a point to establish like

[00:44:30] she hasn't been here since she was five unless I miss something it just was very kind of indicative of

[00:44:36] the general perspective and like through line of the screenplay that it was disconfused about

[00:44:41] something as basic as the characters you know exposition and relationship to the main setting

[00:44:47] and I think that kind of energy flows throughout the entire film and also the their mother

[00:44:54] like everything with her it was like you were getting piecemeal information about her and I still

[00:45:00] don't understand what's going on with that woman she's having a hard time being a mom I know so yes

[00:45:07] I mean the reveal that chauncy is not actually real like never was there for Alice and it's all about

[00:45:17] Jessica I actually did think that that reveal was pretty good but once again

[00:45:25] I'm not emotionally invested by that point in the movie because everything else around it is just

[00:45:30] not up to par with the ideas that are at play here I actually do think once again that the premise

[00:45:37] of this has a lot of potential but I just feel that they squandered at every turn with just some

[00:45:44] really poor storytelling I mentioned earlier the therapists who's like here's a number for someone

[00:45:51] call them who who is that person Jessica never calls that person it feels like that that was

[00:45:56] like a deleted scene or something that wasn't that never made the final movie so it's just like

[00:46:01] poor execution all throughout here one of her final thought this is not Molly this is my allergy

[00:46:10] medication that I keep it a Ziploc bag it definitely was Molly she's just covering up

[00:46:18] oh my gosh oh that was a bad that was really really bad but actually kind of genuinely hilarious

[00:46:26] there was one point in the movie where I think it was Alice pointed out to Jessica he's imaginary

[00:46:33] and I ended up doing the Leo point to the screen you know one scene that I thought was pretty like

[00:46:41] good in terms of the creepy levels was when she's having the tea party with the bear and then

[00:46:47] Jessica hears that a woman's voice like calls back and she was like what the fuck who is in here

[00:46:54] that actually got me really good when it was then like she gets tackled and you find

[00:46:58] it's such a dumb like reveal it's the ex-wife well yeah and that's what I was saying like I don't

[00:47:03] know what is going on with the ex-wife throughout this entire film like I I can tell that she is not

[00:47:10] in a good place but I was like what happened here and why couldn't that not tie into the overall

[00:47:16] story then in that case too right but I will say though yes the reveal of like Jessica

[00:47:21] gang tackled by a physical like woman in that moment did shock me and like kind of jolt to be in my

[00:47:27] seat I was like what is happening you know but then when they said it's my crazy ex-wife who

[00:47:32] like broke out the mental asylum I was like this is so stupid yeah the beginning of that was

[00:47:40] actually like a really interesting idea and I liked the setup but once again the follow through

[00:47:46] and the execution just so so poor and yeah as I was mentioned then we get like nothing more

[00:47:51] of that character that seems like should have more relevance to this story but nope it was like

[00:47:56] just used for one kind of cheap jump scare and then that was it and so bad remind me again is

[00:48:03] there a line in this that is a I maybe I'm imagining this but I sort of wrote this down on my notes

[00:48:09] and I just want to know if someone can confirm from me is there indeed a moment here where somebody

[00:48:13] where somebody says a line that is something similar to I'm gonna destroy this bear I'm gonna kill

[00:48:20] this bear I'm gonna like you know burn this bear I don't know something along the lines the main

[00:48:25] to main character right before is revealed that there there is no bear she goes I know I have to do

[00:48:30] I have to destroy that bear and it's like nearly triumphant but then immediately undercut by the

[00:48:35] reveal that the bear is not real I mean I just wish this movie had a hard r-rating just so that we

[00:48:40] could have gotten like a line like I'm gonna fuck this bear up or something it just it could have been

[00:48:46] so much better it could have been so much more fun yeah but as is it's a major disappointment

[00:48:52] a miss for Blumhouse like you said earlier Cody um this is not the worst film I've seen

[00:48:57] this year but it's pretty damn close I'm giving it a two out of ten Denilla what about you

[00:49:02] yeah yeah two for me that's uh that sums it up pretty easily Emma I gave it a four out of ten

[00:49:08] initially but I think I will be knocking it down to three out of ten for this rating

[00:49:13] Cody I'm out of three out of ten I was thinking about it too but I'm gonna give a little bit of

[00:49:19] credit to the amount of like actors and costumes and practical effects which you know if it was

[00:49:24] 15 to 20 years ago I would be considering but I I'm always happy to see that even in a

[00:49:30] piece of shit movie like this yeah I was gonna say too I can't even applaud them for that because

[00:49:34] I imagine that that was done more for budget constraints more than artistic vision so that's like

[00:49:40] I can't give them the benefit of the doubt here on short. Sure but I'm just happy to see it

[00:49:45] and like I saw early in the credits that it said like special makeup effects by so I was already

[00:49:49] kind of prepared for something a bit more hands-on than just a bunch of CGI images. That makes sense

[00:49:55] Josh what about you yeah when I walked down I gave it a four out of ten and I think that actually

[00:50:01] is where I'm gonna stay like I've said before that once I get below a four that stuff that I

[00:50:06] actively like really don't like and the movie just didn't inspire that much of an emotion for me

[00:50:12] like I said either way I did not really feel anything while watching this movie so like it's

[00:50:18] somewhat competently made and it's got a few decent moments that'll work fine I guess but

[00:50:25] I didn't actively hate the movie that's the thing I just found it to be so bland and forgettable

[00:50:29] that it's like whatever and that to me is where like a four out of ten is something like this really

[00:50:35] did give me a deeper appreciation for why something like Megan worked as well as it did yes and

[00:50:43] we all I'm saying is that's we need more of that I think that we need to just lean into one side

[00:50:48] or the other but trying to find this like happy middle ground here it's just not gonna work for

[00:50:53] today's audiences even if this film because I will give it this too it has had effective marketing

[00:50:59] to where people are gonna probably check it out I imagine but I think they are gonna walk out of

[00:51:03] it very very disappointed in the end yeah Megan is a movie with personality to it yeah and when

[00:51:10] you have a CGI bear that is expressionless and has no personality it's like what are we doing

[00:51:17] anyway this movie made me want to impale myself with a nail so yeah that's so that's how I feel

[00:51:23] about it's Oscar potential and that's how I feel about the movie yeah no no no no no no no

[00:51:30] so with that said I'm a sassick where can they find you on the internet you can find me on Twitter

[00:51:34] at Emma underscore sassick and letterbox and Instagram at Emma sassick did he have a castra

[00:51:41] on twitter at denieless castra kody darrix twitter letterboxed instagram everywhere at kody

[00:51:47] monster 91 if you want to hear me talk about some some better horror movies listen to my podcast

[00:51:52] follow readers of horror movie podcast and chosh parm you can find me on twitter and letterboxed

[00:51:57] jr parm and you can find me at next best picture thank you so much everyone for listening to

[00:52:02] the next best picture podcast we are proud to be part of the evergreen podcast network and

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