Emotional Resilience, Grief & Storytelling with Coach Deepak Deopure

[00:00:00] [SPEAKER_00]: Those who have had a profound loss, a significant loss, you know, a loss of a loved one, a loss

[00:00:05] [SPEAKER_00]: of a relationship, a loss of any kind of loss that actually brings down your whole life.

[00:00:11] [SPEAKER_02]: Agree, stories have an innate healing power so please use that superpower that you already

[00:00:18] [SPEAKER_02]: have, share stories with others and also be an audience to somebody who is going through

[00:00:25] [SPEAKER_02]: the journey by...

[00:00:26] [SPEAKER_00]: If you are feeling emotionally not able to manage your emotions, lot of stress, you

[00:00:32] [SPEAKER_00]: feel that you are not giving...you're not able to give your best to your family, to

[00:00:37] [SPEAKER_00]: your career, to your financial needs, to your status or so and it is impacting different

[00:00:42] [SPEAKER_00]: areas of your life.

[00:00:43] [SPEAKER_00]: Please don't do try to do it on your own.

[00:00:47] [SPEAKER_00]: And imagine it like a painkiller for the moment because you are not yet ready to

[00:00:51] [SPEAKER_00]: experience that pain, your body or your physiology makes you feel the feeling of numbness and

[00:00:59] [SPEAKER_00]: then you can't experience any pain at that point of time.

[00:01:01] [SPEAKER_02]: Welcome to Confident Storytelling Podcast.

[00:01:05] [SPEAKER_02]: The podcast will story shape leaders, ignite change and connect us all.

[00:01:12] [SPEAKER_02]: I am your host Harithosh Rewaasthav, a storytelling and public speaking coach.

[00:01:17] [SPEAKER_02]: Whether you are a professional, an entrepreneur or a coach, this is your space to discover

[00:01:24] [SPEAKER_02]: how to craft and deliver stories that inspire, build trust and influence those around you.

[00:01:33] [SPEAKER_02]: Here we'll dive deep into techniques, real life examples and personal experiences that

[00:01:40] [SPEAKER_02]: will elevate your storytelling skills and boost your confidence.

[00:01:46] [SPEAKER_02]: Let's transform the way you communicate one story at a time.

[00:01:52] [SPEAKER_02]: Hi everyone, welcome to another episode of Confident Storytelling Podcast.

[00:01:58] [SPEAKER_02]: And in this episode I am going to interview India's leading grief coach Deepak Devpure.

[00:02:03] [SPEAKER_02]: Deepak is an internationally certified grief and emotional resilience coach.

[00:02:08] [SPEAKER_02]: He specializes in helping individuals navigate the difficult process of grieving after

[00:02:15] [SPEAKER_02]: a significant loss.

[00:02:16] [SPEAKER_02]: As someone who has the first-hand experience in navigating, Deepak understands how overwhelming

[00:02:22] [SPEAKER_02]: and confusing it can feel.

[00:02:25] [SPEAKER_02]: And that's why he is passionate about providing a safe and supportive space for his clients

[00:02:30] [SPEAKER_02]: to work through their emotions, develop coping strategies and find a path forward.

[00:02:37] [SPEAKER_02]: In this episode we test upon various topics including Deepak and my own journey of

[00:02:43] [SPEAKER_02]: griefs, how unhandled grief can manifest in various forms, how men and women handle

[00:02:49] [SPEAKER_02]: grief differently, what are the stages in grief and also what is the core

[00:02:54] [SPEAKER_02]: significance of storytelling when it comes to resolving grief and loss.

[00:03:00] [SPEAKER_02]: I hope you're going to enjoy this interview as I enjoyed interviewing Deepak

[00:03:04] [SPEAKER_02]: and let's get started.

[00:03:06] [SPEAKER_02]: Welcome everyone to another episode of Confident Storytelling Podcast

[00:03:10] [SPEAKER_02]: and welcome Deepak. How are you doing?

[00:03:14] [SPEAKER_00]: Hey, Harithosh. Thank you for having me.

[00:03:17] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm doing great actually mid of the month now and looking forward to

[00:03:23] [SPEAKER_00]: complete some of the things that I intend to do in the rest of the month

[00:03:27] [SPEAKER_00]: and yeah, how have you been doing?

[00:03:31] [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, not too bad. The best part is I am finally recording some episode

[00:03:36] [SPEAKER_02]: for my Confident Storytelling Podcast getting to converse with people like you

[00:03:42] [SPEAKER_02]: from diverse background listening to their stories and getting lessons out of it.

[00:03:48] [SPEAKER_02]: My favorite part so let's get right into it.

[00:03:51] [SPEAKER_02]: Deepak, I know a little bit about your story but I want the listeners of this podcast

[00:03:57] [SPEAKER_02]: or viewers of this video on YouTube as well to know more about your story

[00:04:04] [SPEAKER_02]: what happened and how it went through and then we'll dig deeper into the different aspects

[00:04:10] [SPEAKER_02]: and your journey so far.

[00:04:14] [SPEAKER_00]: Alright, Harithosh. So the story goes like that I am also coming from a corporate background.

[00:04:23] [SPEAKER_00]: Being in the IT industry like you also for 16 years somewhere around similar, right?

[00:04:29] [SPEAKER_00]: We have been and in the same company apparently that we have worked for quite long

[00:04:33] [SPEAKER_00]: so we have shared a very unique connection.

[00:04:37] [SPEAKER_00]: The last company is you're still you have been associated with that.

[00:04:42] [SPEAKER_00]: So that's my corporate life and I was quite happy as such going on with my corporate life

[00:04:49] [SPEAKER_00]: wasn't for quite long for about 6 to 7 years, 7 to 8 years around

[00:04:53] [SPEAKER_00]: I was in the European geography working in Netherlands in Amsterdam

[00:04:57] [SPEAKER_00]: things were going quite fine along with my daughter and my wife.

[00:05:01] [SPEAKER_00]: We were living there and suddenly life had to take a U-turn

[00:05:08] [SPEAKER_00]: something that was tragic was not expected as such.

[00:05:14] [SPEAKER_00]: In 2018 all of a sudden my wife was detected with blood cancer

[00:05:23] [SPEAKER_00]: and suddenly I was thrown into this pit of kind of a bottomless pit

[00:05:29] [SPEAKER_00]: trying to understand what I should be doing, how I should be coping with all these things.

[00:05:36] [SPEAKER_00]: But apparently I focused more on getting her treatment

[00:05:41] [SPEAKER_00]: and starting her treatment going through the chemotherapy rounds

[00:05:44] [SPEAKER_00]: and I was quite in a different phase of my career at that point of time

[00:05:49] [SPEAKER_00]: almost like going to join another company that had resigned

[00:05:53] [SPEAKER_00]: for PCS at that time and looking forward to maybe kind of settle down a little bit there

[00:06:00] [SPEAKER_00]: but then the focus has to be shifted to the treatment.

[00:06:07] [SPEAKER_00]: So I stayed in PCS at that time and continued starting her treatment

[00:06:11] [SPEAKER_00]: which went on for next 6 months with the help of my parents

[00:06:16] [SPEAKER_00]: and my in-laws they just shuffled a little bit for couple of months to support me during this

[00:06:23] [SPEAKER_00]: and my daughter was also around like 2.5 years old at that point of time

[00:06:27] [SPEAKER_00]: so quite difficult phase for me

[00:06:31] [SPEAKER_00]: and things went on initially good

[00:06:34] [SPEAKER_00]: she was treatment was going well also but eventually at the end

[00:06:39] [SPEAKER_00]: there was a process called a stem cell transplant that she had to go through

[00:06:43] [SPEAKER_00]: and unfortunately during that period, during that phase

[00:06:47] [SPEAKER_00]: she got infected with the virus

[00:06:50] [SPEAKER_00]: and people with cancer treatment they have their immune systems in those processes

[00:06:57] [SPEAKER_00]: brought down to zero I would say.

[00:07:00] [SPEAKER_00]: So at that time if at all any minor infection can be like threatening

[00:07:04] [SPEAKER_00]: and unfortunately that happened

[00:07:07] [SPEAKER_00]: she got infected and then she was moved to ICU because of her kidney started to fail

[00:07:13] [SPEAKER_00]: and slowly over the period over the next 20 days one by one her organs started to fail

[00:07:18] [SPEAKER_00]: other organs and eventually I lost her in 2019

[00:07:23] [SPEAKER_00]: and that was, I suddenly found myself

[00:07:30] [SPEAKER_00]: not knowing what to do how to do

[00:07:32] [SPEAKER_00]: how to manage these emotions

[00:07:36] [SPEAKER_00]: I was still in a disbelief for a long period of time

[00:07:41] [SPEAKER_00]: in a foreign country still I didn't move immediately to India

[00:07:45] [SPEAKER_00]: I continued to stay there for about a year

[00:07:49] [SPEAKER_00]: with the support of my parents also

[00:07:51] [SPEAKER_00]: because I was in a good place working had very great colleagues who supported me all the way along

[00:07:57] [SPEAKER_00]: so I did not want to take any drastic step in my career at that time of time

[00:08:02] [SPEAKER_00]: because I knew that I'm not in the right state to take any big decision

[00:08:07] [SPEAKER_00]: so I continued to give myself six months

[00:08:10] [SPEAKER_00]: that okay during this six months I'll just hang around doing whatever is there

[00:08:15] [SPEAKER_00]: just not taking any drastic steps

[00:08:19] [SPEAKER_00]: so that's what I did for the next one year actually

[00:08:22] [SPEAKER_00]: stayed there in Netherlands

[00:08:24] [SPEAKER_00]: but then I eventually decided to move back to India

[00:08:28] [SPEAKER_00]: and that's when I came back to India

[00:08:32] [SPEAKER_00]: I realized that what I am doing is no longer fulfilling me

[00:08:36] [SPEAKER_00]: no longer feeling me that happiness that I was looking for

[00:08:40] [SPEAKER_00]: and that I used to get when I was doing my job

[00:08:44] [SPEAKER_00]: and I lost that meaning of why I should be doing

[00:08:49] [SPEAKER_00]: to make money and maybe to have a great life

[00:08:55] [SPEAKER_00]: so all that thing became quite superficial for me

[00:09:00] [SPEAKER_00]: and I felt this is not what I want

[00:09:03] [SPEAKER_00]: and during this process I mean

[00:09:06] [SPEAKER_00]: spirituality was a great savior for me

[00:09:10] [SPEAKER_00]: certain philosophical schools of Indian philosophy

[00:09:13] [SPEAKER_00]: which I really got connected with me

[00:09:16] [SPEAKER_00]: because that helped in my own healing journey

[00:09:18] [SPEAKER_00]: and I felt that this is what I want to continue spending my time in it

[00:09:22] [SPEAKER_00]: if I have to spend time in certifications

[00:09:25] [SPEAKER_00]: learning and all those things

[00:09:27] [SPEAKER_00]: that is a part and parcel of upskilling

[00:09:29] [SPEAKER_00]: but then I found that okay I have a clash of timing

[00:09:34] [SPEAKER_00]: if I have to give time to what I am doing on the spiritual front

[00:09:37] [SPEAKER_00]: I do not have time to do anything on the

[00:09:40] [SPEAKER_00]: to grow in my career in the IT

[00:09:42] [SPEAKER_00]: so I realize that now when I know that this is what I like

[00:09:47] [SPEAKER_00]: I want to align my career in a way

[00:09:49] [SPEAKER_00]: that whatever time I am spending on into that area

[00:09:52] [SPEAKER_00]: should be helpful in my career in some way

[00:09:55] [SPEAKER_00]: if not completely

[00:09:57] [SPEAKER_00]: okay

[00:09:59] [SPEAKER_00]: and then I was with this idea of thinking for next 6 months

[00:10:05] [SPEAKER_00]: or so I would say 2020

[00:10:06] [SPEAKER_00]: during the COVID period I was contemplating on this

[00:10:09] [SPEAKER_00]: even in 2021 till the half year

[00:10:13] [SPEAKER_00]: so I would say end of 2020

[00:10:16] [SPEAKER_00]: I get into that thought that okay this is not what I want to

[00:10:22] [SPEAKER_00]: and for 6 months I was contemplating on that

[00:10:25] [SPEAKER_00]: I did not knew what to do how to do

[00:10:28] [SPEAKER_00]: but somewhere you know

[00:10:29] [SPEAKER_00]: I got remembered one of my friend had told me that you can be a coach

[00:10:34] [SPEAKER_00]: I did not knew who is a coach

[00:10:36] [SPEAKER_00]: because of some conversations that I was having

[00:10:41] [SPEAKER_00]: with that person and then

[00:10:44] [SPEAKER_00]: she told me like that and then

[00:10:46] [SPEAKER_00]: I thought okay let's have a look what is a coach

[00:10:49] [SPEAKER_00]: okay

[00:10:50] [SPEAKER_00]: I googled on internet and found out okay there is a

[00:10:53] [SPEAKER_00]: a profession like a coaching like that and where people can actually help

[00:10:59] [SPEAKER_00]: you know in different niches and different areas

[00:11:02] [SPEAKER_00]: so I went into some course training program

[00:11:06] [SPEAKER_00]: I found it nice

[00:11:07] [SPEAKER_00]: that's where my journey started into coaching space

[00:11:11] [SPEAKER_00]: and I realized that this is what I like it

[00:11:13] [SPEAKER_00]: I will enjoy it helping people

[00:11:15] [SPEAKER_00]: helping people into those areas

[00:11:17] [SPEAKER_00]: and that's when at that time I had that thought

[00:11:21] [SPEAKER_00]: that okay I want to help people in the area of grief and resilience

[00:11:25] [SPEAKER_00]: because that's where my own personal experience had been

[00:11:30] [SPEAKER_00]: but I did not had much clarity about how I should be doing that

[00:11:35] [SPEAKER_00]: so I started with career coaching

[00:11:36] [SPEAKER_00]: okay

[00:11:38] [SPEAKER_00]: and went on I'm still doing career coaching as part of my coaching

[00:11:43] [SPEAKER_00]: niches

[00:11:44] [SPEAKER_00]: but for last one year or so then I went back again into those

[00:11:49] [SPEAKER_00]: you need to work on the grief and resilience coaching

[00:11:53] [SPEAKER_01]: right

[00:11:53] [SPEAKER_00]: I got myself a founder mentor, great mentor who

[00:11:58] [SPEAKER_00]: who can actually help me into

[00:12:03] [SPEAKER_00]: materializing all these coaching aspects for this particular niche

[00:12:08] [SPEAKER_00]: and that's when the journey started

[00:12:10] [SPEAKER_00]: so now I am

[00:12:12] [SPEAKER_00]: mainly focused into grief and resilience where I work with people

[00:12:16] [SPEAKER_00]: into you know those who have had a profound loss

[00:12:20] [SPEAKER_00]: a significant loss you know loss of a loved one

[00:12:23] [SPEAKER_00]: a loss of a relationship, loss of any kind of loss

[00:12:26] [SPEAKER_00]: that actually brings down your whole life right

[00:12:31] [SPEAKER_00]: so this is the area that I work with people to

[00:12:35] [SPEAKER_00]: to bring that resilience back to bounce back from this kind of a situation

[00:12:39] [SPEAKER_00]: which they face

[00:12:40] [SPEAKER_00]: so that they actually you know come back and face the light

[00:12:45] [SPEAKER_00]: as they would like to rather than just be a victim

[00:12:48] [SPEAKER_00]: and you know accept as what has happened because

[00:12:52] [SPEAKER_00]: these kind of things are not something that we choose for ourselves right

[00:12:56] [SPEAKER_00]: they happen

[00:12:56] [SPEAKER_00]: absolutely

[00:12:57] [SPEAKER_01]: right

[00:12:57] [SPEAKER_00]: so that's what I am you know doing and this is the area that I work with

[00:13:02] [SPEAKER_02]: I know because we both are from the same mentor

[00:13:06] [SPEAKER_02]: whose ecosystem we are part of

[00:13:09] [SPEAKER_02]: and that's how we connected and

[00:13:11] [SPEAKER_02]: and then we figure out that we are

[00:13:14] [SPEAKER_02]: at so many different levels

[00:13:16] [SPEAKER_02]: we are having a correlation to say

[00:13:20] [SPEAKER_02]: so we worked in the similar company

[00:13:22] [SPEAKER_02]: and at the time of recording I am going through my own

[00:13:26] [SPEAKER_02]: resignation period I have no calm sense in that

[00:13:28] [SPEAKER_02]: so yes I have decided to move on and make it my full career as such

[00:13:33] [SPEAKER_02]: and then there is another level that I connected with you

[00:13:38] [SPEAKER_02]: which probably I haven't told you before

[00:13:40] [SPEAKER_02]: or maybe I don't remember

[00:13:42] [SPEAKER_02]: which is about this grief part because I remember

[00:13:49] [SPEAKER_02]: in 2021

[00:13:50] [SPEAKER_02]: even though I had many instances where I had

[00:13:54] [SPEAKER_02]: like know a lot of

[00:13:57] [SPEAKER_02]: said backs in life I got my visa rejected in US

[00:14:00] [SPEAKER_02]: that was a big blow to my

[00:14:02] [SPEAKER_02]: no confidence and ego and then

[00:14:06] [SPEAKER_02]: for the almost

[00:14:08] [SPEAKER_02]: 10 months or 11 months I was all alone in a house

[00:14:12] [SPEAKER_02]: contemplating of ok this is great corporate life

[00:14:15] [SPEAKER_02]: what is it that I want to do

[00:14:17] [SPEAKER_02]: but in

[00:14:20] [SPEAKER_02]: 2021

[00:14:21] [SPEAKER_02]: I came back to India after a year and

[00:14:26] [SPEAKER_02]: with the events happening

[00:14:29] [SPEAKER_02]: suddenly my mother passed away

[00:14:30] [SPEAKER_02]: and it was we were and she was pretty young

[00:14:33] [SPEAKER_02]: she had just turned 61 so she wasn't very old

[00:14:37] [SPEAKER_02]: or she had certain medical issues but

[00:14:39] [SPEAKER_02]: we were not expected expecting that to happen

[00:14:42] [SPEAKER_02]: so soon we knew something like that will happen

[00:14:45] [SPEAKER_02]: eventually next 5-10 years

[00:14:47] [SPEAKER_02]: but that certainly happened and that was a big blow

[00:14:50] [SPEAKER_02]: which I wasn't prepared so it took me

[00:14:52] [SPEAKER_02]: some time to grasp and I remember that

[00:14:57] [SPEAKER_02]: we had our flight in like 5 days

[00:14:59] [SPEAKER_02]: to go back to London

[00:15:02] [SPEAKER_02]: and it was early morning and suddenly said that

[00:15:05] [SPEAKER_02]: no I don't think I'm gonna survive and we thought

[00:15:08] [SPEAKER_02]: ok maybe she's having a pain and she's kind of

[00:15:11] [SPEAKER_02]: people say when they are in so much of pain and all

[00:15:14] [SPEAKER_02]: but within next 15 minutes

[00:15:17] [SPEAKER_02]: she actually passed away and I was

[00:15:19] [SPEAKER_02]: shocked from the core what just happened

[00:15:23] [SPEAKER_02]: and it took me some time to

[00:15:27] [SPEAKER_02]: grasp that

[00:15:28] [SPEAKER_02]: to make peace with it to go on

[00:15:31] [SPEAKER_02]: and I feel like we are so

[00:15:33] [SPEAKER_02]: as sons we are so connected to our mothers

[00:15:36] [SPEAKER_02]: a part of us is always with her in some form

[00:15:39] [SPEAKER_02]: or in spirituality or something and I still

[00:15:42] [SPEAKER_02]: feel that I'm making her proud at different levels

[00:15:46] [SPEAKER_02]: so that was a level I don't think I have shared with you earlier

[00:15:49] [SPEAKER_02]: but when I heard about your story

[00:15:53] [SPEAKER_02]: somewhere that part of my story also came out

[00:15:55] [SPEAKER_02]: like yes I connect to Deepak on that

[00:15:58] [SPEAKER_02]: so first of all thank you for sharing and your journey

[00:16:01] [SPEAKER_02]: has been yeah I would say very

[00:16:04] [SPEAKER_02]: very unfortunate to start off with nothing

[00:16:06] [SPEAKER_02]: like that should happen to anyone

[00:16:08] [SPEAKER_00]: sorry for your loss as well because this is the first time I'm hearing about

[00:16:11] [SPEAKER_00]: you haven't said that although we have spoken a lot many times before

[00:16:15] [SPEAKER_00]: yes yes there are always some things about

[00:16:18] [SPEAKER_00]: ourselves that you know we don't know and we keep it to

[00:16:21] [SPEAKER_00]: ourselves and when only a right time comes then you share

[00:16:24] [SPEAKER_02]: so I think thanks for sharing yeah suddenly I mean

[00:16:27] [SPEAKER_02]: I mean I wasn't also preparing but when

[00:16:30] [SPEAKER_02]: prepared to say that but few minutes before

[00:16:33] [SPEAKER_02]: this podcast I don't know from where it came

[00:16:35] [SPEAKER_02]: and I can probably talk about so sometime you have these

[00:16:38] [SPEAKER_02]: universal you know signals that happen to

[00:16:42] [SPEAKER_02]: you and thoughts come so I thought maybe this is a good

[00:16:44] [SPEAKER_02]: place to talk about that and yeah

[00:16:48] [SPEAKER_02]: so something of that sort happening to your life

[00:16:51] [SPEAKER_02]: where your life suddenly goes from where you are trying

[00:16:54] [SPEAKER_02]: to settle down to completely shattered

[00:16:57] [SPEAKER_02]: but I love how you have taken that

[00:17:00] [SPEAKER_02]: towards spirituality towards

[00:17:03] [SPEAKER_02]: taking it or making it as a mission

[00:17:06] [SPEAKER_02]: to heal others and

[00:17:09] [SPEAKER_02]: I want to ask you the question is

[00:17:12] [SPEAKER_02]: you took a big decision

[00:17:14] [SPEAKER_02]: to came back to India because you were there

[00:17:17] [SPEAKER_02]: almost you had if I'm not wrong you had the opportunity to

[00:17:20] [SPEAKER_02]: continue as well

[00:17:22] [SPEAKER_02]: what do you think were the factors behind coming back

[00:17:26] [SPEAKER_02]: to India and you had a young

[00:17:29] [SPEAKER_02]: daughter as well so I talk to a lot of parents

[00:17:32] [SPEAKER_02]: and lot of parents actually crave for them to go out

[00:17:35] [SPEAKER_02]: of the country and get them educated and

[00:17:38] [SPEAKER_02]: so many other factors as well what were your factors

[00:17:41] [SPEAKER_02]: to actually come back to India

[00:17:45] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah I mean I was

[00:17:47] [SPEAKER_00]: although I was living there in Netherlands always

[00:17:50] [SPEAKER_00]: I had this feeling that you know I want to go back to India

[00:17:53] [SPEAKER_00]: at certain time you know

[00:17:55] [SPEAKER_00]: there were times when he used to when I used to hear the song

[00:17:59] [SPEAKER_00]: of Sadesi, De Sethira and

[00:18:01] [SPEAKER_00]: I used to connect with that so long that okay

[00:18:05] [SPEAKER_00]: so but

[00:18:06] [SPEAKER_00]: the things where you know I mean I was in a good

[00:18:10] [SPEAKER_00]: place you know with good colleagues great

[00:18:12] [SPEAKER_00]: work my wife was also happy

[00:18:15] [SPEAKER_00]: you know my daughter was born so we thought okay let's

[00:18:18] [SPEAKER_00]: for some time let's continue here

[00:18:21] [SPEAKER_00]: and live there right but when she passed away

[00:18:24] [SPEAKER_00]: all of a sudden and then I had no clue

[00:18:27] [SPEAKER_00]: how to live in a foreign country all alone

[00:18:32] [SPEAKER_00]: care of my daughter

[00:18:33] [SPEAKER_00]: while doing my job okay

[00:18:37] [SPEAKER_00]: although yes I had some great friends

[00:18:40] [SPEAKER_00]: who were like you know don't worry about everything

[00:18:42] [SPEAKER_00]: we are there to support you anytime you want

[00:18:45] [SPEAKER_00]: any help we are there to support you there were some great friends that I had

[00:18:49] [SPEAKER_00]: they are still my great friends okay but

[00:18:51] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah I mean I had you know

[00:18:55] [SPEAKER_00]: we I felt that okay I cannot depend on you know

[00:18:58] [SPEAKER_00]: yes family is someone that you

[00:19:01] [SPEAKER_00]: first like to depend on right because everyone has their

[00:19:04] [SPEAKER_00]: life everyone has their priorities in their

[00:19:07] [SPEAKER_00]: life although they would have all definitely helped me and they are

[00:19:10] [SPEAKER_00]: still in connection with me even after five years

[00:19:13] [SPEAKER_00]: so

[00:19:16] [SPEAKER_00]: especially the teacher her day care teacher

[00:19:19] [SPEAKER_00]: you know she's a Dutch lady

[00:19:20] [SPEAKER_00]: she was so good and she

[00:19:23] [SPEAKER_00]: I mean helped me a lot in all those

[00:19:27] [SPEAKER_00]: times when I was going through this trouble

[00:19:29] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm still connected with her okay

[00:19:33] [SPEAKER_00]: so I had good but

[00:19:35] [SPEAKER_00]: the thoughts that I took mainly

[00:19:38] [SPEAKER_00]: is that you know my daughter her school was going to get started

[00:19:42] [SPEAKER_00]: so I thought okay this is if her school

[00:19:44] [SPEAKER_00]: starts then again it will go into the flow and then I will have to

[00:19:48] [SPEAKER_00]: secondly I needed support I definitely needed

[00:19:50] [SPEAKER_00]: support and I was not in that state

[00:19:53] [SPEAKER_00]: can I can manage it on my own even after

[00:19:56] [SPEAKER_00]: one year when I took this decision

[00:19:58] [SPEAKER_00]: I realized that no I cannot manage on my

[00:20:01] [SPEAKER_00]: especially my mental state you know

[00:20:05] [SPEAKER_00]: and if I'm not in the right mental state it will

[00:20:08] [SPEAKER_00]: affect my physical state and both of them

[00:20:11] [SPEAKER_00]: will impact my ability to parent

[00:20:14] [SPEAKER_00]: my daughter to be as a father because now

[00:20:16] [SPEAKER_00]: for me I had to

[00:20:19] [SPEAKER_00]: not only be her father but also her mother

[00:20:23] [SPEAKER_00]: right so that way different responsibilities for me

[00:20:25] [SPEAKER_00]: and I realized that this is not something that I can do on my own

[00:20:31] [SPEAKER_00]: and

[00:20:32] [SPEAKER_00]: that was one of the major decision

[00:20:34] [SPEAKER_00]: I would say that was the major decision and then

[00:20:37] [SPEAKER_00]: I always had that thought that okay eventually I have to go back right so this is

[00:20:41] [SPEAKER_00]: this is the right time no I as I told you

[00:20:44] [SPEAKER_00]: for six months I did not want to take any decision

[00:20:47] [SPEAKER_00]: yes and until the year when I thought

[00:20:50] [SPEAKER_00]: that okay this thought is now continuously there

[00:20:52] [SPEAKER_00]: for my mind for a year that okay I have to go back

[00:20:56] [SPEAKER_00]: so now I knew that okay this is not an impulsive kind

[00:20:59] [SPEAKER_00]: of a thought that I am getting because I am in that state of mind

[00:21:02] [SPEAKER_00]: but it is more of a prolonged thought and more

[00:21:04] [SPEAKER_00]: stable thought so it is the right time to take the decision

[00:21:09] [SPEAKER_00]: and

[00:21:10] [SPEAKER_00]: and I think that was one of the factor and again

[00:21:14] [SPEAKER_00]: being with my parents

[00:21:16] [SPEAKER_00]: being there with the supportive family

[00:21:19] [SPEAKER_00]: was one of the reasons that I took back

[00:21:23] [SPEAKER_00]: to the decision to come back to India

[00:21:26] [SPEAKER_00]: although it was very very difficult I would say

[00:21:28] [SPEAKER_00]: it was very difficult even though it was my own choice

[00:21:32] [SPEAKER_00]: there were things that quite

[00:21:34] [SPEAKER_00]: there are things which were quite good there you know

[00:21:36] [SPEAKER_00]: I mean life is quite easy there as it compared to India

[00:21:39] [SPEAKER_00]: that is very well right things are very sorted

[00:21:42] [SPEAKER_00]: you have you know day cares to take care of your children

[00:21:46] [SPEAKER_00]: the office timings are you know properly

[00:21:49] [SPEAKER_00]: under balance and you know so things

[00:21:53] [SPEAKER_00]: are there but you need emotional support as well

[00:21:56] [SPEAKER_00]: right when this period during this

[00:21:58] [SPEAKER_00]: period and so it

[00:22:01] [SPEAKER_00]: was a tough decision schooling was also one of the factor

[00:22:04] [SPEAKER_00]: that I was considering because I really liked the schooling

[00:22:07] [SPEAKER_00]: in Netherlands the way they

[00:22:10] [SPEAKER_00]: help children to you know understand

[00:22:13] [SPEAKER_00]: the strengths and so the answer unique

[00:22:16] [SPEAKER_00]: but I thought you know that cannot be just

[00:22:19] [SPEAKER_00]: the reason I can stay there because

[00:22:22] [SPEAKER_00]: so that was a factor that I was

[00:22:26] [SPEAKER_00]: it was a difficult and I would say

[00:22:28] [SPEAKER_00]: that was another grief that when I came back to India

[00:22:31] [SPEAKER_00]: see grief is not just about the loss of a loved one

[00:22:34] [SPEAKER_00]: any loss can trigger a grief

[00:22:37] [SPEAKER_00]: so when I came back to India that was also a small

[00:22:40] [SPEAKER_00]: kind of a different kind of a grief that I experienced

[00:22:43] [SPEAKER_00]: all those people who were a part of my life for those

[00:22:46] [SPEAKER_00]: seven years my colleagues my work

[00:22:49] [SPEAKER_00]: I left those behind my house

[00:22:52] [SPEAKER_00]: I left those behind so I felt that grief for

[00:22:55] [SPEAKER_00]: again when I came back to India

[00:22:57] [SPEAKER_00]: so that is the factor

[00:23:00] [SPEAKER_00]: so things are difficult but slowly you get used to it

[00:23:03] [SPEAKER_00]: slowly things get normal

[00:23:06] [SPEAKER_00]: and now I am completely fine

[00:23:09] [SPEAKER_02]: I so much resonate with what you said

[00:23:13] [SPEAKER_02]: grief is not only for humans

[00:23:16] [SPEAKER_02]: or your family and loved ones

[00:23:18] [SPEAKER_02]: but also for places also

[00:23:21] [SPEAKER_02]: for opportunities you got or you missed it because

[00:23:24] [SPEAKER_02]: like I said in 2019 suddenly out of blue

[00:23:29] [SPEAKER_02]: I had to come back from

[00:23:31] [SPEAKER_02]: US to India not on my own choice

[00:23:34] [SPEAKER_02]: and I literally had I can

[00:23:36] [SPEAKER_02]: I can now sense that I had a grief for

[00:23:39] [SPEAKER_02]: 6 months to 1 year where I felt like why me

[00:23:42] [SPEAKER_02]: like why I have been going through that

[00:23:45] [SPEAKER_02]: and for those who don't know US visa

[00:23:48] [SPEAKER_02]: process one of the most difficult

[00:23:51] [SPEAKER_02]: process it's like it went on for a year

[00:23:54] [SPEAKER_02]: and then you prepare so much and you create

[00:23:57] [SPEAKER_02]: and produce so much documentation and then

[00:23:59] [SPEAKER_02]: suddenly you get an email from USCIS

[00:24:03] [SPEAKER_02]: that no okay your visa application is

[00:24:06] [SPEAKER_02]: rejected get out of this country

[00:24:08] [SPEAKER_02]: I felt literally like a slap on my face that after

[00:24:11] [SPEAKER_02]: doing so much I was doing very good

[00:24:15] [SPEAKER_02]: like you I was doing very good professionally as well

[00:24:17] [SPEAKER_02]: I was expecting a promotion I was

[00:24:20] [SPEAKER_02]: extending my portfolio so I was very much

[00:24:23] [SPEAKER_02]: into corporate job but that was like

[00:24:26] [SPEAKER_02]: a big tight slap on me and

[00:24:29] [SPEAKER_02]: I feel like there's still a little bit of grief over there

[00:24:33] [SPEAKER_02]: it was very hard for me also

[00:24:35] [SPEAKER_02]: for next 6 months while everybody was happy because

[00:24:37] [SPEAKER_02]: my family wanted it was like wow you're coming back

[00:24:40] [SPEAKER_02]: and relatives and all I felt like a failure

[00:24:44] [SPEAKER_02]: like why I have to go through it while I'm doing all the

[00:24:47] [SPEAKER_02]: processes like why suddenly

[00:24:49] [SPEAKER_02]: my life's decision is dependent on someone else

[00:24:53] [SPEAKER_02]: I think the seed was

[00:24:56] [SPEAKER_02]: put on that day itself and I had to leave

[00:24:59] [SPEAKER_02]: everything I had literally 10 days to

[00:25:01] [SPEAKER_02]: and I say SP to BHK

[00:25:05] [SPEAKER_02]: to two suitcases so literally I had a proper house

[00:25:08] [SPEAKER_02]: and car another thing in US

[00:25:11] [SPEAKER_02]: and I had to throw and donate

[00:25:14] [SPEAKER_02]: and sell to come back to two suitcases

[00:25:17] [SPEAKER_02]: that's what I became in 10 days

[00:25:19] [SPEAKER_02]: while 10 days before I was thinking I'll probably

[00:25:22] [SPEAKER_02]: getting a promotion, we're doing this and that

[00:25:24] [SPEAKER_02]: I felt like a big failure

[00:25:28] [SPEAKER_02]: at that time and I can now associate

[00:25:32] [SPEAKER_02]: when you say grief is not only about people

[00:25:34] [SPEAKER_02]: that was a big grief in terms of career

[00:25:37] [SPEAKER_02]: and I could say then from there my disassociation

[00:25:40] [SPEAKER_02]: now that I'm going out I can say my disassociation

[00:25:43] [SPEAKER_02]: started with work in terms of

[00:25:45] [SPEAKER_02]: it work is not the only thing

[00:25:48] [SPEAKER_02]: and everything I have other things to also

[00:25:51] [SPEAKER_02]: focus on and that's where the journey started so

[00:25:54] [SPEAKER_02]: very much associate with you on that

[00:25:58] [SPEAKER_00]: that's right I mean you rightly said actually

[00:26:01] [SPEAKER_00]: that is also grief any

[00:26:03] [SPEAKER_00]: process in life wherein you are not able to

[00:26:06] [SPEAKER_00]: manage your emotions or you are doubting your emotions

[00:26:09] [SPEAKER_00]: they are in a roller coaster

[00:26:11] [SPEAKER_00]: and you know you are not feeling controlled

[00:26:14] [SPEAKER_00]: you do not have the control on your emotions that is an experience of grief

[00:26:18] [SPEAKER_00]: right any kind of a loss

[00:26:21] [SPEAKER_00]: any kind of a dependency

[00:26:24] [SPEAKER_00]: that you had on something someone

[00:26:27] [SPEAKER_00]: that is taken away can trigger a grief

[00:26:29] [SPEAKER_00]: feeling of grief

[00:26:30] [SPEAKER_02]: absolutely thank you

[00:26:33] [SPEAKER_02]: so next question for you is

[00:26:37] [SPEAKER_02]: because as we discovered

[00:26:39] [SPEAKER_02]: in that I had two times grief which

[00:26:42] [SPEAKER_02]: I would say undiscovered grief how common

[00:26:45] [SPEAKER_02]: is it for people to experience

[00:26:48] [SPEAKER_02]: these kind of grief like what are some of the symptoms

[00:26:51] [SPEAKER_02]: or some other things that people can observe about

[00:26:54] [SPEAKER_02]: themselves and then feel like ok maybe I am going through this

[00:26:57] [SPEAKER_02]: grief or journey

[00:27:00] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah one of the biggest

[00:27:04] [SPEAKER_00]: indicator of grief is

[00:27:06] [SPEAKER_00]: overwhelming stress

[00:27:10] [SPEAKER_00]: because stress goes

[00:27:12] [SPEAKER_00]: along with grief because when you are in a

[00:27:15] [SPEAKER_00]: grief right there will be many situations in your life

[00:27:18] [SPEAKER_00]: that will be a trigger point for you

[00:27:22] [SPEAKER_00]: for giving you stress maybe there is

[00:27:24] [SPEAKER_00]: there is your career there is a financial situation

[00:27:28] [SPEAKER_00]: maybe children, childcare and so many things

[00:27:30] [SPEAKER_00]: all around the situation is

[00:27:33] [SPEAKER_00]: not in your favor I would say kind of in a turbulent

[00:27:36] [SPEAKER_00]: weather wherein you imagine a ship which is in a

[00:27:39] [SPEAKER_00]: turbulent storm kind of a feeling

[00:27:41] [SPEAKER_00]: if you feel like that you know you are in a storm and all the way

[00:27:45] [SPEAKER_00]: you are just being like you know

[00:27:47] [SPEAKER_00]: pushed all over have no control

[00:27:49] [SPEAKER_00]: you feel no control about your emotions

[00:27:52] [SPEAKER_00]: one day you feel ok the next moment you don't feel ok

[00:27:56] [SPEAKER_00]: feelings and emotions like sadness

[00:27:58] [SPEAKER_00]: anger, depression, guilt

[00:28:01] [SPEAKER_00]: blame ok these are

[00:28:04] [SPEAKER_00]: some of the emotions that go along with grief

[00:28:06] [SPEAKER_00]: guilt is also one of the big emotions

[00:28:10] [SPEAKER_00]: so many emotions and they keep on

[00:28:13] [SPEAKER_00]: switching over you know one point of sadness

[00:28:16] [SPEAKER_00]: then you have a guilt and have your

[00:28:20] [SPEAKER_00]: depression and so many different things

[00:28:22] [SPEAKER_00]: and you find it difficult to

[00:28:25] [SPEAKER_00]: contemplate what is it one more emotion

[00:28:28] [SPEAKER_00]: that is very common in grief is called as numbness

[00:28:32] [SPEAKER_00]: you just don't feel anything

[00:28:34] [SPEAKER_02]: you don't feel anything

[00:28:35] [SPEAKER_00]: and you feel you doubt this feeling

[00:28:40] [SPEAKER_00]: how can I feel like that

[00:28:42] [SPEAKER_00]: I mean I had a huge loss like this

[00:28:45] [SPEAKER_00]: and I am just not feeling anything

[00:28:47] [SPEAKER_00]: I just feel numb to anything kind of

[00:28:49] [SPEAKER_00]: and it is more commonly associated with the

[00:28:53] [SPEAKER_00]: loss of a loved one or relationship loss

[00:28:55] [SPEAKER_00]: where you had love involved you know more of a

[00:28:59] [SPEAKER_00]: person there so you get the

[00:29:02] [SPEAKER_00]: numbness kind of a feeling this is

[00:29:05] [SPEAKER_00]: it's a very strange feeling to be in

[00:29:08] [SPEAKER_00]: how can I feel like that ok

[00:29:11] [SPEAKER_00]: but you know that is a very normal feeling

[00:29:14] [SPEAKER_00]: it is normal it is your body's way

[00:29:16] [SPEAKER_00]: to protect you because you are not ready

[00:29:20] [SPEAKER_00]: to take on that whole pain at this moment

[00:29:22] [SPEAKER_00]: imagine it like that you know when you are going to a dentist for a root canal

[00:29:26] [SPEAKER_00]: you know the doctor

[00:29:29] [SPEAKER_00]: gives you that painkiller because the pain that is going to come

[00:29:32] [SPEAKER_00]: with that root canal is not something that you will be able to bear

[00:29:34] [SPEAKER_00]: that is to give you that painkiller

[00:29:38] [SPEAKER_00]: so that numbness you can imagine is like a painkiller

[00:29:41] [SPEAKER_00]: for the moment because you are not yet ready to

[00:29:43] [SPEAKER_00]: to you know experience that pain

[00:29:46] [SPEAKER_00]: your body or your physiology

[00:29:49] [SPEAKER_00]: makes you feel the feeling of numbness

[00:29:52] [SPEAKER_00]: and then you can't experience any pain at that point of time

[00:29:56] [SPEAKER_00]: so that is a very common association

[00:29:59] [SPEAKER_00]: it can also you feel this in different kind of

[00:30:01] [SPEAKER_00]: griefs and different losses as well

[00:30:03] [SPEAKER_00]: but if you feel like that numbness you know

[00:30:06] [SPEAKER_00]: just feel

[00:30:09] [SPEAKER_00]: no interest nothing

[00:30:11] [SPEAKER_00]: nothing interest me there is no source of happiness

[00:30:14] [SPEAKER_00]: that is coming to you you feel anxiety all the time

[00:30:18] [SPEAKER_00]: anxious, worried, stressed

[00:30:21] [SPEAKER_00]: these are some of the typical symptoms

[00:30:23] [SPEAKER_00]: of that you are experiencing grief and

[00:30:26] [SPEAKER_00]: if a grief it is actually researched like that

[00:30:29] [SPEAKER_00]: or a grief a strong grief

[00:30:32] [SPEAKER_00]: and if it stays with you for

[00:30:35] [SPEAKER_00]: more than three months it has actually the capability

[00:30:38] [SPEAKER_00]: to physically manifest

[00:30:40] [SPEAKER_00]: illness in your body

[00:30:42] [SPEAKER_00]: it can physically manifest some kind of illness in your body

[00:30:45] [SPEAKER_00]: it has been researched it has been scientifically proven

[00:30:48] [SPEAKER_00]: because then there is a lot of stress

[00:30:51] [SPEAKER_00]: and those fight-and-flight response that you

[00:30:53] [SPEAKER_00]: that actually protect you at initial stages

[00:30:56] [SPEAKER_00]: they become a chronic stress

[00:30:58] [SPEAKER_00]: that chronic stress

[00:31:00] [SPEAKER_00]: ensures that all those stress hormones

[00:31:03] [SPEAKER_00]: cortisol and those they are always there in your system

[00:31:06] [SPEAKER_00]: because then of course that's an energy right

[00:31:09] [SPEAKER_00]: if that energy is not dissipated in any way

[00:31:12] [SPEAKER_00]: it can take a form

[00:31:15] [SPEAKER_00]: energy can neither be destroyed nor be created

[00:31:18] [SPEAKER_00]: and can change the forms

[00:31:21] [SPEAKER_00]: so it changes its form it takes a physical form

[00:31:25] [SPEAKER_00]: form of maybe a back pain

[00:31:27] [SPEAKER_00]: or you know a stomach pain

[00:31:30] [SPEAKER_00]: or a headache or kind of or you frequently fall in

[00:31:33] [SPEAKER_00]: or your immune system goes down

[00:31:34] [SPEAKER_00]: so many things and I experienced that myself

[00:31:37] [SPEAKER_00]: it started the lower back pain started for me

[00:31:40] [SPEAKER_00]: after around a year or so

[00:31:43] [SPEAKER_00]: suddenly all of a sudden that lower back pain was

[00:31:45] [SPEAKER_00]: quite hard for me and then I started yoga for that

[00:31:49] [SPEAKER_00]: so that has helped me

[00:31:51] [SPEAKER_00]: for the past two years I am continuously doing and that has helped me

[00:31:54] [SPEAKER_00]: so yeah that's the thing

[00:31:57] [SPEAKER_02]: I'm having too many

[00:32:00] [SPEAKER_02]: realization moments now I mean I

[00:32:03] [SPEAKER_02]: figured it out like similar to you when I was going through

[00:32:06] [SPEAKER_02]: that period 10 days period

[00:32:09] [SPEAKER_02]: I couldn't sleep on a bed because I was having so much

[00:32:12] [SPEAKER_02]: of back pain of course there was so much of stress

[00:32:15] [SPEAKER_02]: my mother was undergoing a surgery

[00:32:17] [SPEAKER_02]: I could not travel because of visa thing

[00:32:20] [SPEAKER_02]: and then I got this big blow to my thing

[00:32:24] [SPEAKER_02]: and I had 10 days so those 10 days

[00:32:27] [SPEAKER_02]: last 10 days I actually slept on the floor

[00:32:29] [SPEAKER_02]: because I couldn't lie down on the bed

[00:32:33] [SPEAKER_02]: at any second because it was such a chronic back pain

[00:32:36] [SPEAKER_02]: and I can very well say when you say

[00:32:38] [SPEAKER_02]: it is probably the manifestation of the stress

[00:32:41] [SPEAKER_02]: and the grief that no and I figured out

[00:32:44] [SPEAKER_02]: afterwards I came back I did some tests and all

[00:32:47] [SPEAKER_02]: they said it's vitamin D deficiency

[00:32:49] [SPEAKER_02]: but suddenly after a few months when I was able to make

[00:32:53] [SPEAKER_02]: patch it automatically disappeared

[00:32:56] [SPEAKER_02]: so I said that it may not be directly the vitamin

[00:32:59] [SPEAKER_02]: D and things like that but it was definitely

[00:33:02] [SPEAKER_02]: and I have observed myself like we all

[00:33:05] [SPEAKER_02]: that whenever I'm having a few stress I start

[00:33:08] [SPEAKER_02]: I redevelop those back pain

[00:33:11] [SPEAKER_02]: so that's indication for me that something is not right

[00:33:14] [SPEAKER_02]: and I have to look at what is it that I'm stressing too much on

[00:33:18] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah your body is a

[00:33:22] [SPEAKER_00]: is as a natural mechanism

[00:33:24] [SPEAKER_00]: in it to indicate you there is something going wrong

[00:33:27] [SPEAKER_00]: in it yeah but we are just

[00:33:29] [SPEAKER_00]: being attentive towards it

[00:33:31] [SPEAKER_00]: if you are attentive towards it it will give us the indication

[00:33:35] [SPEAKER_00]: that something is going wrong take care about me

[00:33:37] [SPEAKER_00]: right so that

[00:33:40] [SPEAKER_00]: and it comes with experience and then you

[00:33:43] [SPEAKER_00]: realization correct so get that it becomes easier

[00:33:46] [SPEAKER_00]: for you to proactively prepare

[00:33:49] [SPEAKER_00]: for such kind of situations that might be happening

[00:33:52] [SPEAKER_02]: brilliant so I have

[00:33:55] [SPEAKER_02]: this one question like and

[00:33:59] [SPEAKER_02]: does men and women react

[00:34:02] [SPEAKER_02]: differently to grief or is it individual to individual

[00:34:07] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah that's a very good question actually

[00:34:09] [SPEAKER_00]: it's often and of course when I

[00:34:11] [SPEAKER_00]: was going through my training program with my mentor

[00:34:14] [SPEAKER_00]: he also covered these things how people

[00:34:17] [SPEAKER_00]: greet differently you know the answer is this

[00:34:20] [SPEAKER_00]: that actually everyone greets differently

[00:34:22] [SPEAKER_00]: not even everyone every time you greet differently

[00:34:26] [SPEAKER_02]: okay yeah it is not that

[00:34:28] [SPEAKER_00]: for this loss you are grieving like that but

[00:34:32] [SPEAKER_00]: every loss that you will face in your life you will always

[00:34:35] [SPEAKER_00]: greet like that it is not like that every loss

[00:34:37] [SPEAKER_00]: can I trigger it like every pregnancy is different

[00:34:40] [SPEAKER_00]: that's what women is they say right

[00:34:42] [SPEAKER_00]: it's like that the grief is every grief is different so definitely

[00:34:46] [SPEAKER_00]: for everyone for men or women also

[00:34:49] [SPEAKER_00]: it can be different right but there is

[00:34:52] [SPEAKER_00]: something that is common there is something that has been

[00:34:55] [SPEAKER_00]: observed more of like you know men have a

[00:34:58] [SPEAKER_00]: tendency to not talk about it

[00:35:01] [SPEAKER_00]: typically men have a tendency to okay

[00:35:04] [SPEAKER_00]: because we are raised in a world where

[00:35:10] [SPEAKER_00]: they cannot show their vulnerability to the

[00:35:14] [SPEAKER_00]: world right we have been living into

[00:35:17] [SPEAKER_00]: that world you know highly optimistic

[00:35:19] [SPEAKER_00]: manly world right which is

[00:35:22] [SPEAKER_00]: which has actually you know for men has not

[00:35:25] [SPEAKER_00]: worked for it that way and that's why

[00:35:28] [SPEAKER_00]: in so many situations when

[00:35:31] [SPEAKER_00]: when we face some such kind of

[00:35:34] [SPEAKER_00]: disruptions like that men tend to actually isolate

[00:35:36] [SPEAKER_00]: or they do not talk about it

[00:35:39] [SPEAKER_00]: so that's what it is

[00:35:42] [SPEAKER_00]: observation but not always okay

[00:35:44] [SPEAKER_00]: so this is a typical woman have a tendency

[00:35:47] [SPEAKER_00]: to more talk about it they are more open to

[00:35:50] [SPEAKER_00]: actually taking help as I see most of

[00:35:54] [SPEAKER_00]: I would see men almost

[00:35:57] [SPEAKER_00]: 100% of my clients are women

[00:35:59] [SPEAKER_00]: 100% I would say

[00:36:01] [SPEAKER_00]: so even though there are men have reached out to me

[00:36:06] [SPEAKER_00]: and we have had some calls but eventually they did not

[00:36:09] [SPEAKER_00]: take and went ahead for the support

[00:36:11] [SPEAKER_00]: and that's what also indicates me that okay even

[00:36:14] [SPEAKER_00]: there is how much ever they feel like it

[00:36:16] [SPEAKER_00]: they do not take that step or they do not

[00:36:18] [SPEAKER_00]: you know they sit on the edge and they do not take that plan

[00:36:21] [SPEAKER_00]: to take the help while women are more open

[00:36:25] [SPEAKER_00]: for taking help you know they are

[00:36:28] [SPEAKER_00]: they feel and they are more expressive about their emotions

[00:36:31] [SPEAKER_00]: okay so that's typically

[00:36:35] [SPEAKER_00]: that is also actually that's what I can say

[00:36:38] [SPEAKER_02]: very true very true I think yeah this is how we have been conditioned

[00:36:43] [SPEAKER_02]: at least in our Indian context that

[00:36:45] [SPEAKER_02]: men are supposed to not talk openly about their emotion

[00:36:49] [SPEAKER_02]: what's going on and yes now that we have started

[00:36:54] [SPEAKER_02]: celebrating these happy Father's Day and things like that

[00:36:56] [SPEAKER_02]: I think yeah men are becoming

[00:36:59] [SPEAKER_02]: little bit vocal about that but I think still they have a long way to go

[00:37:03] [SPEAKER_02]: so what is your advice for

[00:37:07] [SPEAKER_02]: both women of course they are vocal about it but

[00:37:10] [SPEAKER_02]: especially for men who are going through

[00:37:13] [SPEAKER_02]: this period of no rejection

[00:37:17] [SPEAKER_02]: that no I can't go through that or they understand that

[00:37:21] [SPEAKER_02]: but still they are at the cliff that okay

[00:37:23] [SPEAKER_02]: maybe it will heal them by itself

[00:37:26] [SPEAKER_02]: I don't need to do anything what's your advice for those people

[00:37:31] [SPEAKER_00]: right so again a good question Aritosh

[00:37:35] [SPEAKER_00]: because you know

[00:37:36] [SPEAKER_00]: especially in our Indian culture in our Indian context

[00:37:40] [SPEAKER_00]: we have this rituals that are associated after

[00:37:43] [SPEAKER_00]: you know a loss of a love one with 13 days rituals

[00:37:46] [SPEAKER_00]: and so on where in we are given a dedicated

[00:37:49] [SPEAKER_00]: time to actually you know grieve and moan

[00:37:52] [SPEAKER_00]: you are allowed to cry and you are allowed to

[00:37:55] [SPEAKER_00]: or do everything you know to express your sadness

[00:37:59] [SPEAKER_00]: and your depression during that period

[00:38:01] [SPEAKER_00]: but once that 13 days over everyone will go back into their life

[00:38:06] [SPEAKER_00]: no one is going to talk about it

[00:38:08] [SPEAKER_00]: that is how we are conditioned and

[00:38:12] [SPEAKER_00]: and that is actually

[00:38:14] [SPEAKER_00]: you know culturally we have devised this although it has some

[00:38:17] [SPEAKER_00]: some scientific theories about it you know with respect to karma

[00:38:21] [SPEAKER_00]: and the soul which is you know you want to actually

[00:38:26] [SPEAKER_00]: help the soul to move into its next

[00:38:28] [SPEAKER_00]: into its next stage of its evolution

[00:38:31] [SPEAKER_00]: that's why it is said that

[00:38:33] [SPEAKER_00]: you know to not to

[00:38:36] [SPEAKER_00]: emotionally try to connect the soul because somewhere at a connect

[00:38:39] [SPEAKER_00]: at a different dimension we are still

[00:38:43] [SPEAKER_00]: okay so that has that context

[00:38:45] [SPEAKER_00]: but that does not mean that you are not supposed to

[00:38:48] [SPEAKER_00]: talk about it that does not mean that you are not supposed to grieve about it

[00:38:52] [SPEAKER_00]: or you are not supposed to because it

[00:38:54] [SPEAKER_00]: grieve doesn't follow a timeline

[00:38:59] [SPEAKER_00]: so some people can grieve for the whole life

[00:39:01] [SPEAKER_00]: they can grieve for one year for two years

[00:39:03] [SPEAKER_00]: for some people it does happen that second year is

[00:39:06] [SPEAKER_00]: more tougher than first year also have seen in many

[00:39:09] [SPEAKER_00]: cases right so there are certain needs that

[00:39:12] [SPEAKER_00]: I that that I believe that

[00:39:15] [SPEAKER_00]: these are the needs of grief and we have to address those

[00:39:18] [SPEAKER_00]: needs in order for you to not

[00:39:20] [SPEAKER_00]: go into a complicated grief

[00:39:23] [SPEAKER_00]: a complicated grief wherein you are just not able to manage it

[00:39:27] [SPEAKER_00]: right so and as I said

[00:39:30] [SPEAKER_00]: right if you are allowing if you are not moving ahead in your grief

[00:39:33] [SPEAKER_00]: you are not observing and you are stuck in your grief

[00:39:36] [SPEAKER_00]: the grief has a tendency to manifest into a physical form

[00:39:39] [SPEAKER_00]: so that is one of that is the reason that you have to

[00:39:42] [SPEAKER_00]: address the grief so

[00:39:44] [SPEAKER_00]: but the needs of grief that I would say is the grief has to be witnessed

[00:39:49] [SPEAKER_00]: right so what does I mean

[00:39:50] [SPEAKER_00]: with that is like you know grief is basically

[00:39:53] [SPEAKER_00]: again now it's very interesting to what you do

[00:39:56] [SPEAKER_00]: there is a story in us that we want to tell

[00:39:59] [SPEAKER_00]: correct right what has happened

[00:40:02] [SPEAKER_00]: you know what how this happened

[00:40:06] [SPEAKER_00]: all that story you want to tell someone

[00:40:10] [SPEAKER_00]: right and

[00:40:11] [SPEAKER_00]: of course that story the version of the

[00:40:14] [SPEAKER_00]: story keeps on changing over the time once you get the hold

[00:40:18] [SPEAKER_00]: of the grief or so right but have a need

[00:40:20] [SPEAKER_00]: of telling that story to people

[00:40:24] [SPEAKER_00]: right and that is the first

[00:40:26] [SPEAKER_00]: need of grief second need of grief is about expressing

[00:40:30] [SPEAKER_00]: your emotion now when you are telling the stories

[00:40:32] [SPEAKER_00]: right you also express your emotions

[00:40:35] [SPEAKER_00]: right you give a right

[00:40:39] [SPEAKER_00]: expression to those emotions whatever it is it is a sadness

[00:40:41] [SPEAKER_00]: or anger also if you are giving it a safe

[00:40:45] [SPEAKER_00]: space if you are working with someone as a professional

[00:40:47] [SPEAKER_00]: or a coach right the coach can help

[00:40:51] [SPEAKER_00]: you to express those emotions in a right

[00:40:54] [SPEAKER_00]: in a more safe way

[00:40:57] [SPEAKER_00]: okay anger can express

[00:40:59] [SPEAKER_00]: can be expressed in a very bad way by you know

[00:41:02] [SPEAKER_00]: going and hitting someone or maybe breaking your

[00:41:04] [SPEAKER_00]: TV or anything or it can also be expressed

[00:41:07] [SPEAKER_00]: in a much more safer way yes so the coach

[00:41:10] [SPEAKER_00]: can actually get that expression out you know

[00:41:14] [SPEAKER_00]: find out coping strategies

[00:41:17] [SPEAKER_00]: right so that's the second need you know expression

[00:41:20] [SPEAKER_00]: because emotions not getting expressed will not

[00:41:24] [SPEAKER_00]: will not they will not dry off

[00:41:26] [SPEAKER_00]: they will take a difficult form

[00:41:29] [SPEAKER_00]: because again as I said they are energy

[00:41:32] [SPEAKER_00]: energy if the emotion wants to come out in the form

[00:41:34] [SPEAKER_00]: of sadness you have to give it the right platform

[00:41:37] [SPEAKER_00]: if it wants to come out in the form of anger you have to give that platform

[00:41:41] [SPEAKER_00]: you cannot say that okay no I am going to suffer

[00:41:44] [SPEAKER_00]: it's like a pressure cooker at certain point

[00:41:47] [SPEAKER_02]: of time it will burst yeah absolutely

[00:41:50] [SPEAKER_00]: that's the second need of grief the third need

[00:41:52] [SPEAKER_00]: of grief is to you know

[00:41:56] [SPEAKER_00]: to

[00:41:59] [SPEAKER_00]: the guilt basically if there is a guilt associated

[00:42:01] [SPEAKER_00]: in your grief that is a very very strong emotion

[00:42:05] [SPEAKER_00]: if you have a feeling

[00:42:08] [SPEAKER_00]: that if at all I did that if I

[00:42:10] [SPEAKER_00]: would have done that then this wouldn't have happened

[00:42:13] [SPEAKER_00]: that if this is there

[00:42:16] [SPEAKER_00]: then it has to be worked upon the guilt has to be worked upon

[00:42:19] [SPEAKER_00]: okay so that's the third need of grief

[00:42:22] [SPEAKER_00]: okay so the fourth need of grief is

[00:42:26] [SPEAKER_00]: about you know

[00:42:29] [SPEAKER_00]: if there are

[00:42:31] [SPEAKER_00]: old wounds often in our

[00:42:34] [SPEAKER_00]: childhood we experience sometimes

[00:42:37] [SPEAKER_00]: you know some kind of situations where

[00:42:40] [SPEAKER_00]: it creates our personality maybe

[00:42:43] [SPEAKER_00]: some people are experienced bullying

[00:42:46] [SPEAKER_00]: and then devise a way that isolation is a

[00:42:49] [SPEAKER_00]: way for me to protect myself

[00:42:52] [SPEAKER_00]: okay so that might have helped them at that point of time

[00:42:55] [SPEAKER_00]: but that is not the right way of dealing it

[00:42:58] [SPEAKER_00]: in your grief so old wounds have a tendency

[00:43:01] [SPEAKER_00]: to come back in your grief journey

[00:43:04] [SPEAKER_00]: okay and you will not

[00:43:06] [SPEAKER_00]: understand why I am behaving like that

[00:43:09] [SPEAKER_00]: it is actually coming from an old

[00:43:11] [SPEAKER_00]: so that you can see I am feeling is also needed

[00:43:14] [SPEAKER_00]: at that point of time

[00:43:15] [SPEAKER_00]: the fifth need of grief is

[00:43:22] [SPEAKER_00]: finding a meaning and a purpose

[00:43:24] [SPEAKER_00]: at some point of time

[00:43:26] [SPEAKER_00]: it is not a meaning in the loss itself there is no meaning

[00:43:29] [SPEAKER_00]: in the loss okay it is a meaning

[00:43:32] [SPEAKER_00]: for you after the loss

[00:43:34] [SPEAKER_00]: so how you can

[00:43:37] [SPEAKER_00]: carry the legacy of that person

[00:43:40] [SPEAKER_00]: that relationship that thing

[00:43:43] [SPEAKER_00]: that you lived right you know like again the

[00:43:46] [SPEAKER_00]: loss for you was the US visa rejection

[00:43:48] [SPEAKER_00]: how can you carry you have carried that legacy by actually

[00:43:52] [SPEAKER_00]: one of the as you only said right one of the trigger

[00:43:54] [SPEAKER_00]: of doing what you are doing is somewhere has that root

[00:43:58] [SPEAKER_00]: right absolutely 100%

[00:44:01] [SPEAKER_00]: legacy to it right that there is

[00:44:03] [SPEAKER_00]: something that is coming from that right

[00:44:06] [SPEAKER_00]: so meaning now you have found out a meaning in that

[00:44:09] [SPEAKER_00]: loss right so meaning

[00:44:12] [SPEAKER_00]: and a purpose for you after that loss is something

[00:44:15] [SPEAKER_00]: again it cannot be have it cannot

[00:44:18] [SPEAKER_00]: happen very early in the grief at the time when you are

[00:44:21] [SPEAKER_00]: ready for it then it has to be worked upon

[00:44:24] [SPEAKER_00]: but you know that is what are the

[00:44:27] [SPEAKER_00]: needs of grief and

[00:44:30] [SPEAKER_00]: this is what I would say we are and everyone

[00:44:33] [SPEAKER_00]: has the same needs of these are the same needs of

[00:44:36] [SPEAKER_00]: if you are feeling emotionally not

[00:44:39] [SPEAKER_00]: able to manage your emotions lot of stress

[00:44:41] [SPEAKER_00]: you feel that you are not giving your

[00:44:45] [SPEAKER_00]: you are not able to give your best your family to your career

[00:44:47] [SPEAKER_00]: to your financial needs to your status or so

[00:44:50] [SPEAKER_00]: and it is impacting different areas of your life

[00:44:54] [SPEAKER_00]: please don't do try to do it on your own

[00:44:57] [SPEAKER_00]: at least from a coach

[00:44:59] [SPEAKER_00]: someone as a life coach can also help but the

[00:45:02] [SPEAKER_00]: grief coach is a better person who knows

[00:45:05] [SPEAKER_00]: exactly how to help you into this and bring

[00:45:08] [SPEAKER_00]: that resilience in your life so that you can bounce back

[00:45:11] [SPEAKER_00]: from this adversity or a disruption

[00:45:14] [SPEAKER_00]: so that is what I would say

[00:45:17] [SPEAKER_02]: thank you so much for sharing that and I think

[00:45:19] [SPEAKER_02]: I could correlate on different level of course

[00:45:22] [SPEAKER_02]: stories I think is one of the first

[00:45:25] [SPEAKER_02]: needs that you mentioned about telling your

[00:45:28] [SPEAKER_02]: stories and I think one of the healing

[00:45:31] [SPEAKER_02]: that has happened with me because I started telling the story

[00:45:34] [SPEAKER_02]: and for the very first year I told because I am part of

[00:45:37] [SPEAKER_02]: Toastmaster and other places wherever I got a chance

[00:45:39] [SPEAKER_02]: I went it out don't know whether it's right or wrong

[00:45:43] [SPEAKER_02]: but I think somewhere when telling the story

[00:45:46] [SPEAKER_02]: that contributed to healing now I can feel that

[00:45:50] [SPEAKER_02]: because that was somewhere

[00:45:52] [SPEAKER_02]: my story and I wanted to convey a message but

[00:45:55] [SPEAKER_02]: like you said to went through emotions and guilt

[00:45:58] [SPEAKER_02]: wound but ultimately I found a meaning and purpose

[00:46:01] [SPEAKER_02]: that I don't want to let anybody else decide

[00:46:04] [SPEAKER_02]: the fate of my life or journey or things so

[00:46:07] [SPEAKER_02]: so I decided yes I am not going back to US

[00:46:10] [SPEAKER_02]: for work even though I had multiple opportunities and then eventually

[00:46:13] [SPEAKER_02]: it led me towards thinking about

[00:46:16] [SPEAKER_02]: shift in the career becoming an entrepreneur

[00:46:19] [SPEAKER_02]: and coach and helping people and it also gave me

[00:46:22] [SPEAKER_02]: a meaning that how can I help people

[00:46:25] [SPEAKER_02]: who are having great skills

[00:46:28] [SPEAKER_02]: in terms of execution coding but they are not able to express

[00:46:31] [SPEAKER_02]: how I can empower that so that's also

[00:46:33] [SPEAKER_02]: a meaning and purpose given to me so thank you so much for sharing

[00:46:37] [SPEAKER_02]: and as you said guys if you are not

[00:46:40] [SPEAKER_02]: sure what the needs of your grief are

[00:46:44] [SPEAKER_02]: I highly recommend that get a coach sometime

[00:46:48] [SPEAKER_02]: the least investment that we do is on our self

[00:46:52] [SPEAKER_02]: but I believe the best return that you

[00:46:54] [SPEAKER_02]: get is when you invest in our self be it

[00:46:58] [SPEAKER_02]: learning skill be it

[00:47:01] [SPEAKER_02]: building network but also

[00:47:03] [SPEAKER_02]: getting a coach for whichever area of the life

[00:47:06] [SPEAKER_02]: it's not only related to one health or money

[00:47:09] [SPEAKER_02]: or skills but also relationship

[00:47:12] [SPEAKER_02]: but also grief and resilience I think this is

[00:47:15] [SPEAKER_02]: very very important for us as

[00:47:18] [SPEAKER_02]: humans to work on those and understand that

[00:47:21] [SPEAKER_02]: sometime we need expert help and there are expert out there

[00:47:24] [SPEAKER_02]: who specialize, who know what exactly

[00:47:27] [SPEAKER_02]: your next steps are going to be and yeah Deepak

[00:47:30] [SPEAKER_02]: is one such coach in India

[00:47:33] [SPEAKER_02]: which I know who has worked on

[00:47:36] [SPEAKER_02]: this who has gone is not somebody

[00:47:40] [SPEAKER_02]: who has gone through the journey is certified

[00:47:42] [SPEAKER_02]: resilience and grief coach and has worked many people

[00:47:45] [SPEAKER_02]: so if you feel like you need to discuss something

[00:47:48] [SPEAKER_02]: how can somebody reach out to you Deepak

[00:47:51] [SPEAKER_00]: yeah definitely

[00:47:52] [SPEAKER_00]: I can be reached out through my website

[00:47:57] [SPEAKER_00]: Deepaktheopere.com, okay my name, first time and last time

[00:48:00] [SPEAKER_00]: okay and of course

[00:48:03] [SPEAKER_00]: directly via my email through my email

[00:48:06] [SPEAKER_00]: connect at deepaktheopere.com

[00:48:08] [SPEAKER_00]: or in my website there are also my number

[00:48:11] [SPEAKER_00]: my number is also there that you can check out and you can reach out to me

[00:48:14] [SPEAKER_00]: so multiple ways, LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram

[00:48:17] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm there at all the places right and

[00:48:21] [SPEAKER_00]: anywhere if you feel like

[00:48:23] [SPEAKER_00]: I could be of any help to you

[00:48:26] [SPEAKER_00]: in your own journey of your grief and resilience

[00:48:30] [SPEAKER_00]: or so then I would be really happy to help you

[00:48:32] [SPEAKER_00]: and anyone who is listening out to you

[00:48:36] [SPEAKER_02]: Thank you so much Deepak and

[00:48:37] [SPEAKER_02]: I think this the universe conspiring us to meet such amazing humans

[00:48:42] [SPEAKER_02]: I think had I met you earlier

[00:48:44] [SPEAKER_02]: I would have healed much faster but thank you so much

[00:48:48] [SPEAKER_02]: So what is your one last message

[00:48:51] [SPEAKER_02]: for the listeners and the viewers

[00:48:53] [SPEAKER_02]: of this podcast, what is your one message for them

[00:48:58] [SPEAKER_00]: My one message is the work that you are doing

[00:49:01] [SPEAKER_00]: Haritosh is stories have such a

[00:49:05] [SPEAKER_00]: beautiful connection with our lives

[00:49:07] [SPEAKER_00]: and I always tell that in my coaching sessions also with my clients

[00:49:13] [SPEAKER_00]: just say whatever you want to say

[00:49:16] [SPEAKER_00]: and they often start it happened on that day

[00:49:20] [SPEAKER_00]: and a story always starts

[00:49:22] [SPEAKER_00]: like that, on that day

[00:49:24] [SPEAKER_00]: so there is a lot of

[00:49:27] [SPEAKER_00]: inherent need in our human psychology to tell stories

[00:49:31] [SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely 100%

[00:49:33] [SPEAKER_00]: and when we tell stories and when we hear stories

[00:49:37] [SPEAKER_00]: they contribute in our healing

[00:49:39] [SPEAKER_00]: and healing others

[00:49:43] [SPEAKER_00]: So if there is a story

[00:49:45] [SPEAKER_00]: if there is a story that you would like to say

[00:49:48] [SPEAKER_00]: and if there is a story that you would like to tell to this world

[00:49:50] [SPEAKER_00]: don't shy away from any story

[00:49:52] [SPEAKER_00]: any story is not a bad story

[00:49:54] [SPEAKER_00]: any story is a good story for you

[00:49:58] [SPEAKER_00]: to heal others and also yourself

[00:50:00] [SPEAKER_00]: and there are so many opportunities

[00:50:02] [SPEAKER_00]: I know that you also teach in your programs how to find out different topics

[00:50:07] [SPEAKER_00]: of creating stories also

[00:50:08] [SPEAKER_00]: but your life has

[00:50:12] [SPEAKER_00]: gives you so many opportunities to tell so many stories

[00:50:17] [SPEAKER_00]: and that is what the last message would be

[00:50:20] [SPEAKER_00]: If you are grieving, if you are in your process of grieving

[00:50:23] [SPEAKER_00]: you are finding it difficult to manage your emotions

[00:50:25] [SPEAKER_00]: stress, at least find a friend

[00:50:28] [SPEAKER_00]: at least

[00:50:31] [SPEAKER_00]: some family member with whom you can talk about it

[00:50:34] [SPEAKER_00]: at least be a listener to someone where you are not

[00:50:37] [SPEAKER_00]: judging them

[00:50:38] [SPEAKER_00]: If you want to help someone

[00:50:43] [SPEAKER_00]: this is the best thing that you can do is just be there

[00:50:46] [SPEAKER_00]: and listen, you do not have to say anything

[00:50:49] [SPEAKER_00]: and if you want to be helped

[00:50:52] [SPEAKER_00]: find a friend or family member

[00:50:54] [SPEAKER_00]: with whom you can just talk

[00:50:57] [SPEAKER_00]: 50% of the time that helps

[00:51:00] [SPEAKER_00]: that is what you want

[00:51:03] [SPEAKER_00]: shy away from talking about your emotions

[00:51:08] [SPEAKER_00]: that is what I wish to say

[00:51:10] [SPEAKER_02]: Thank you so much and as you said

[00:51:12] [SPEAKER_02]: I agree stories have an innate healing power

[00:51:17] [SPEAKER_02]: so please use that superpower

[00:51:19] [SPEAKER_02]: that you already have share stories with others

[00:51:23] [SPEAKER_02]: and also be an audience to somebody who is going through the journey

[00:51:27] [SPEAKER_02]: by without having any bias

[00:51:31] [SPEAKER_02]: without having any

[00:51:35] [SPEAKER_02]: decision just listen to people

[00:51:37] [SPEAKER_02]: I think that would really help make this word a better place

[00:51:40] [SPEAKER_02]: Thank you so much Deepak

[00:51:42] [SPEAKER_02]: It was an honor and a privilege to have you in the Confidence Storytelling podcast

[00:51:46] [SPEAKER_02]: I am looking forward to having more such episodes in future as well

[00:51:51] [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely

[00:51:51] [SPEAKER_00]: I was loving to have you Haritosh

[00:51:53] [SPEAKER_00]: now always get inspired with the work and dedication that you put

[00:51:58] [SPEAKER_00]: with your work so kudos to you

[00:52:01] [SPEAKER_00]: and to your viewers and your listeners

[00:52:03] [SPEAKER_00]: Thank you so much for having me

[00:52:04] [SPEAKER_02]: Thank you so much for listening to this episode of

[00:52:14] [SPEAKER_02]: Spot Cards Hope you found this useful

[00:52:17] [SPEAKER_02]: If you did rate us on

[00:52:20] [SPEAKER_02]: Apple Podcast so that it reaches more people

[00:52:23] [SPEAKER_02]: Do share this episode with someone who may need to hear this

[00:52:26] [SPEAKER_02]: I can't wait to see you for the next

[00:52:29] [SPEAKER_02]: Veebs episode You can also take a screenshot

[00:52:32] [SPEAKER_02]: and tag me on Instagram as coach Haritosh Revastav

[00:52:36] [SPEAKER_02]: I hope you have a lovely day ahead

[00:52:38] [SPEAKER_02]: Until next time as I say every time

[00:52:41] [SPEAKER_02]: Keep learning, keep growing

[00:52:43] [SPEAKER_02]: and keep going out of your comfort zone

[00:52:46] [SPEAKER_02]: This is Haritosh Revastav

[00:52:48] [SPEAKER_02]: See you next week