Ep 279- War 2 and Coolie Reviews

[00:00:15] Hi, this is Asim. This is Sujoy. This is Amrita. And you're listening to Khandaan, a Bollywood Podcast about the three main Khans of the Hindi film industry. Aamir, Salman, and Shahram. Hi, you're listening to Khandaan, a Bollywood Podcast regular feed. Thank you so much for your support over the years. We now have a Patreon channel with bonus content and exclusive merch for those of you who would like to support us. Every dollar goes towards creating more and better

[00:00:42] content. Visit us at patreon.com slash Khandaan Podcast. Hi, and welcome to a new episode of Khandaan Podcast. My name is Asim Burney, and I'm joined with my lovely co-host Ammu and Suju. What would your name be, Asim? Like, Asu? Asu. Nammei Sadness.

[00:01:17] That's a reference to the War 2 review that will be coming out later in this episode. We're doing a current episode, a current movies release episode. And then next week, you're going to have the wrap up for the 80s, which is Mr. India and our thoughts about the 80s and the Maka series. But yeah, we want to talk about the things that came out this week. I feel we're already a bit late for War 2. I feel the conversation is already done. This movie is

[00:01:45] already dead. Yeah, but we watched it. So you now have to listen to what we thought about. The movie is already dead. Asim has said it. Yeah, it is. It is. It's a dead-on arrival. But a few other things happened. Let's talk about a few of the trailers that dropped, right?

[00:02:27] I don't know how to talk about this show because I still don't know the title of it. What the hell is this show supposed to be called? It's a movie. I have no... No, like what? Badds of Bollywood is what I see the hashtag. Is that what Arion is saying? What is he saying on screen? I have no idea. I don't know. Like what word does it mean? Like I've seen people try to say like

[00:02:52] bastards of Bollywood, but that's not the number of letters that go into like bastards. So like, I don't know, like ballads... Somebody said like ballads of Bollywood, which makes no sense. Yeah. Why would it be called ballads of Bollywood? Like I don't get it. So yeah, you're right. Like I also don't know what this show is called. It's Aryan Khan's show. Shah Rukh Khan's son.

[00:03:21] The biggest surprise... So I think there's been like a kind of... Like this is getting a massive push, obviously from Netflix. Yay nepotism. Amazing. But I think the first thing that was... People were talking about immediately is how much Aryan's voice sounds like Shah Rukh's voice. It is uncanny, right? Yeah. I have this thing. I don't know if you have this. It's like when people used to call on the landline,

[00:03:50] my aunties and stuff like that would think it's dad. They would say, oh, Sadik Bhai. And I said, no, no, no, it's Asim because my voice sounds similar apparently to my dad's. So I have heard this. But even I, watching that first teaser, lifelong fan of Shah Rukh, Khandan podcast host that had been doing more than 300 episodes about the Khans. I could not distinguish where Shah Rukh Khan's voice stopped and Aryan started, I have to admit.

[00:04:18] The only thing is obviously, and I think it's the same with my dad and me, it's the vocabulary of the language that is definitely not there. But yeah, what did you think of the reveal of the first trailer and the launch and everything about whatever is from Bollywood, the show of Aryan? I mean, I'll be honest, like I didn't actually watch the entire like launch event because I find launch events totally cringe. And that's true of like any launch event. Like I don't watch them.

[00:04:47] Like that's not my scene. But I did find it interesting that like all the Nepo kids went through a phase of being like, no, no, no, actually, we're just like everybody else. And now post Sayara, I feel like they're all just sort of like there's been a switch. And they're just like, you know, no, no, actually, like this is fine. This is good. And I don't know, like maybe for Aryan,

[00:05:15] like there's no way that he can run away from that legacy. You know what I mean? Like he looks exactly like Shah Rukh. He sounds exactly like Shah Rukh. And no matter how many times he's been telling everyone from like Karin Johar to Farah Khan to like, shut up about his work. They're all out there talking about his business all the time and about how much they love it. I mean, what is his, what's his name? Reed Hastings or whatever, like the CEO of Netflix. He was on

[00:05:43] podcast talking about how much he enjoyed this show. So it's not something that he can get away from. So yeah, he just sort of like really leaned into it. And I think it's kind of worked out for him, to be honest, because the entire Shah Rukh nation has been activated. And they're all just like, here comes our prince, you know, very hypocritical when you consider how they've been treating Sohana.

[00:06:12] But for Aryan, they're going like full on crazy. I mean, it's the Ibrahim Ali Khan thing all over again, right? Like we literally saw it with Sarah Ali Khan and Ibrahim Ali, where red carpet rollout for the boy. And you know, like just big bats for the girl, which is just, yeah, it's, it just, it's interesting that

[00:06:38] a whole generation that's made, you know, a big talking point about how toxic the previous generation is and the aunties and the uncles are doing exactly the same thing. Yeah, we're upholding the patriarchy. Yeah, yeah. No lessons have been learned. And it's exactly what, you know, our people before that were doing. So it's kind of a shame, unfortunately. But I think, can I just say

[00:07:03] like, weirdly, I do think Aryan is more handsome than Shah Rukh in a way. Like, I think it's just being rich, maybe. I also, I also really enjoy, I tell you what I enjoyed the most out of that launch event was like Gauri sitting there like, I won, bitches. You know, like, she's got her son, she's got

[00:07:26] Shah Rukh and she's just like a cat with all the cream in the world, you know? And it was just like, it was really, I mean, I would too, if I were in Gauri's shoes, that is exactly the expression that I would have as well. But what are your expectations about the show, Sujoy? Have you seen a bit of the footage? I've only seen the trailer. It feels like a mix of Zoya and Farha's, you know, insider

[00:07:55] take on Bollywood, Nepo babies, outsider comes into the world and shakes up the system, I suppose. That's what they're going for. It's interesting to see they have taken, you know, the dharma people into the cast basically with Rakhal Jual and Laksh, who are the protagonists, I suppose.

[00:08:20] Interestingly, Bobby Deval is also in it. I was surprised to see Salman have a cameo in the trailer as well. Best part of it. We got re-excited. And yeah, I'm looking forward to it. I would just like to judge the show on its own merits. I have like literally no expectations as of now. Yeah. In a way, I don't want to overhype it in my mind either. You know, I think I'm excited for it

[00:08:48] and I want to watch it. But we have to also just see that, you know, it's going to be a first time director making, like I feel for the boy, like the massive responsibility that's been put on his shoulders to do this. You get the chance. And he's got writing credits. That's what like excites me more. Like what does he, what is his worldview on this? I'm excited. I'm looking forward to it for sure.

[00:09:40] Another release that's happening. And I think it's a I think this is a conversation. I wanted to see what Amrita thought about this. I mean, most of the conversation I want to hear what Amrita thinks about anyway. I want to know, Sujoy. I want to know. The promotion for Param Sundari has been happening. Like a lot of tracks have been dropping, which I actually have been appreciating. I like the music of Param Sundari.

[00:10:05] I do have to say like aside before I get into the main thought is you have the first song. What is the first song called? Is it? Pardesia. I don't know. Yeah, is it Pardesia? It's shot so badly. Like they have this very low close-up angle of Janvi's face. And I do not think it's flattering at all. I don't know who shot that, but it's hard to make Janvi not look good. And they managed to do this in the song.

[00:10:32] I just want to point out, I was telling Sujoy this while we were waiting for you, Asim. The director of Param Sundari is Tushar Jalota, who is the son of Anoop Jalota, which might not mean anything to you. But in India, that's like hilarious. Like Anoop Jalota used to make these cassette tapes, you know, like back in the day, like Mankajudas and Anoop Jalota were like the two people. He is the bhajan lord of India. Yes.

[00:10:58] He literally launched T-Series into career, basically. Like T-Series is built on the backs of Anoop Jalota and Anuradha Paudwal. And it's his son, you know. Right. Yeah. Also like that thing that they styled on, sorry, I have a even more, I'm just totally congested. So names and all that is not, who's the hero? Siddharth? Siddharth Mahotra.

[00:11:27] Yeah. The thing he has, it's just weirdly styled. This whole movie is weirdly styled, but it's again, one of those North and South love stories of, you know, something we've seen a lot of, lot of times. But I think a lot of people have taken offense with how Janvi's character has been portrayed as a South Indian. And I think, I mean, have you seen those reactions, Amrita? Have you seen what the kind of vibe of it is?

[00:11:55] Yes. So all of Malayali Instagram has been up in arms about this, right? And they've basically been mocking it hardcore. I think what happened was like when the Kerala story came out and right now the Kerala story is in the news again, because it won a national award, which is a huge joke. And in that they basically showed like Malayali women going around with like Jasmine in

[00:12:19] their hair and like these really unfortunate clothes. And basically everybody was like, bro, like, like Malayalis are literally the most cosmopolitan, you know, group of people anywhere in India because like we, all of us are expats, you know, every family, you know, you could be from like a very low income family and you would have somebody who's like living abroad.

[00:12:44] So we've always been like dressing like normal people. Like I don't know where this like village aesthetic is coming from, but also Janvi, you know, Janvi is uniquely gifted in that any language she speaks sounds like an alien language. Like we, we already saw that with French. And like a lot of

[00:13:09] people say that about a Hindi and now she's trying to say words in Malayalam that the rest of us are just like, I have no idea what that is. But also her name in this, in this film is Tekapatti, which is like nobody in Kerala follows that format when they're talking about their name, you know.

[00:13:39] And somebody like the one thing you need to know about Malayalis is that we're vicious. So somebody, like we did not know what the cow you have on this podcast. But somebody was just like, you know, who in Kerala calls their, like who in Kerala is named Sundari? A cow. Literally people call their cows Sundari. And that is actually true.

[00:14:09] Nobody, nobody is like calling like their kids Sundari. Like what the hell? So yeah, it's just very funny. But also with a lot of this stuff, you know, a lot of it is just like rage baiting for the clicks, right? Like it's in the scheme of things, like Janvi Kapoor cosplaying a Malayali, like who cares about it? You know, it's,

[00:14:34] it's hardly the worst representation that we've ever had in our lives. And you know, they're not serious because a lot of the videos are also like, why did they take Janvi? They could have taken somebody else. And one of the people they consistently put forward is Kalyani Priyadarshan, who is a very lovely girl, but she is basically the Janvi Kapoor of Malayalam cinema,

[00:15:02] because everybody trolls Kalyani all the time. And they're all talking about like, oh, she can't act. She can't talk. She's terrible at her dialogue delivery. We hate her, blah, blah, blah. And then all of a sudden they're just like, well, why can't she be in this role? And well, because they, you know, this is a movie made by like a bunch of Bollywood people and they already have their own Janvi Kapoor. Why do they need to come down and like get your Janvi Kapoor? So it makes no sense. Also, where is Janvi originally? Isn't she South Indian?

[00:15:32] She's half South Indian. Yeah. Yeah. She's half Punjabi, half South. I think she's, I've seen so many of her videos where she talks, she's very much like, she's more South Indian than she's Punjabi. Like she's like lives there. She has a house there. She, that's how she projected herself before this movie, right? She, I think she basically leans into her South Indian heritage as a way to honor her mother's memory, but that's basically it. I don't think she,

[00:15:58] she's fluent in Tamil or anything or Telugu. Like Shri Devi is from a Telugu family settled in Madras. So her primary languages were Telugu and Tamil, but I don't think either one of her daughters are fluent in either one of those languages. So are you excited for Param Sundari or is this one that you will skip? I don't know. I don't, I don't feel like rushing to the cinema to watch this.

[00:16:28] I watch it. Yeah. Okay. I'll watch it. I mean, I think Param Sundari and Abir Gulal, is it Abir Gulal? Gulal is coming up the same, same day. So I'm probably going to lean towards Abir Gulal. Is Abir Gulal coming out in theatrical release? In the UK it is, the 29th, I think next week it should be coming out. Oh, this week actually. I think it's coming on streaming in India, if I'm not mistaken. Yeah.

[00:16:56] I think even in the poster I got received from the PR agencies, it was literally not releasing in India or something like that. So I'll have a double check, but because the PR of this movie is crazy. It used to be Abir with the I, now it's Abir with double E. So if they're messing up the titles, it's hilarious because in the trailer, it still says it with the I instead of the double E, which is like, what are we even doing? Complete mess.

[00:17:49] You guys saw Kuli, right? Right? Yes. You want to talk about it a bit? Do we have to? We don't have to if you don't want to. I vehemently said I don't watch Rajnikanth movies. Like this is not my thing. Actually, you know what? Jailer was like way more fun than this movie. Yeah. I did see Jailer. I did see Jailer. Jailer was actually entertaining compared to this. But also, like this movie was just mad.

[00:18:18] It was just like, and also the reason why I really dislike this movie is because of Shruti Hassan's character. Yeah. And I'm not a hater. Like I don't hate Shruti Hassan at all. Like I have no issues. Again, like you're talking about Janneke Kapoor. She's like the Telugu Janneke Kapoor, you know? I feel like every industry has her Janneke Kapoor. It's so unfortunate though. Like she's, you know, from family royalty in a way, you know, she's the daughter of the famous Kamal Hassan.

[00:18:47] And then you see all these interviews of her where she's giving like for promotion of Cooley and she's like, oh, I had to shoot this scene for Rajnikanth and I was so intimidated. Okay, that's respect. But then she was like, I had to prepare myself because in one scene I was screaming at him. That's acting. You are 10 plus years into the industry and you are, yeah, this is BS.

[00:19:15] I was just so supremely annoyed here. But also the character that she was playing was such an idiot. Like there is a, like this woman cannot do anything for herself, right? Like she is just like, she's just like sort of like being moved around like a mannequin. There is a scene where like... A weeping mannequin. Yeah. She's crying throughout the movie.

[00:19:40] Like there is a scene where she is standing, she's on a train and the Shorbin Shaheer who's like the bad guy and he's sort of like the Terminator because like he won't be stopped. And he won't die. Yeah. And he follows her onto the train and he is literally beating her. Like, you know, like beating, beating her. Like he's like kicking her in the midriff. Like he's just like beating her.

[00:20:09] And there are other people, like including women, like old aunties on that train who are trying to fight him off. And she's just like staring at him like, oh. I'm so angry. I don't know anything. It's pretty much that. Oh my God. And it's so stupid. And like there's like, they never explain why she's so angry with Rajnikan to the point

[00:20:37] where like she kicks him out of her father's funeral. Like why? Yeah. Like what is that about? Like she does not know who Rajnikanth is, but you won't touch my Baba's corpse. Like what the hell is happening? There is no history between them. And that's the first scene. It's never like explained. And then there's like, and every single time she actually employs agency, like the time when she like convinces Rajnikanth that they should help Shobin Sahir, like Dayal.

[00:21:06] Like it's always like the battle. The worst decision ever. Yeah. And I'm just like, she's just like a giant plot device the entire time. Like there's no like character as such. She's just there so that the plot can keep moving. Um, and it just annoys the shit out of me when I see female characters like that in the year of our Lord 2025. Um, so I had really hated that.

[00:21:33] And also, but I did have a thought when I was watching this movie and I went, uh, on the first day, the day that it released to watch this, because I have a friend who was like a huge Rajnikanth fan. Um, and I did have a thought because, um, you know, like Upendra came out, uh, Nagarjuna was fantastic. I really enjoyed Nagarjuna and Upendra the most out of like all the different, uh, characters and also Shobin Sahir, of course.

[00:22:02] Um, but I had a thought which was that basically the big Bollywood blockbuster is dead. Like they can't compete. Um, because the way these Pan-India things are structured, they're basically getting the fan bases of all these people activated and to come together. Yeah. Um, and they're doing it in a way that is formulaic, but it's also working for them.

[00:22:32] Um, and they have a lock, especially when you compare this to like War II, which we will discuss in a minute. Um, they have a lock on like the elevation scenes, the introduction scenes, the, you know, like all of those things, they have it figured out, bro. Um, and I don't know how Bollywood is going to compete on that same playing field because

[00:22:59] they need to figure out what their language is. Because right now, a lot of Bollywood stuff is just trying to mimic this language and it's not going to work for them. Uh, to counter that, I would say I am a Desi Hindi film audience first, right? So for, for me, the fan service that Akuli provides does not work as much.

[00:23:23] Like the Upendra scenes, the scenes where, you know, even the introduction of Amir Khan in this movie, as an Amir Khan fan, it does not work because it just feels very caricaturish, very like fan service bait. And you can tell that that's what they're going for from a mile. Was it fan service? Because I believe that that's what they went for.

[00:23:49] But my God, like, I need to describe this for you, Asim, because you are the number one Amir fan on our show. It was the only reason I would have considered watching Kuli. So there's a, there's a, there's like this sort of like, I don't know, like the biggest kingpins in the world have come together on some random beach somewhere. Right. And this, this helicopter touches down and then there's like dust flying everywhere. And the door opens and out jump like a trio of huskies. Right.

[00:24:19] Yeah. And then holding their leash is Amir Khan. And Amir has like these giant, those thugs of Hindustan munche, you know, like those big munche and, or the Mangal Pandey munche basically. And, and he's wearing... A sleeve of tattoos. He's wearing like a sleeveless vest and the highest heels ever. Like he's basically Justin Bieber, Justin Bieber with huskies. Right.

[00:24:49] And then he has this expression on his face. I don't, I think he was trying to play it for laughs, but he basically just looks like, like he's developmentally challenged, you know, like the whole time where he's just like, Oh, what happened? Oh, who's this? Oh, what are we doing here? Like literally he's like mouth breathing through the entire scene. And I'm just like, why, why would you do that?

[00:25:17] Like what kind of artistic choice is this? He got a laugh from the Vice cinema though, when he started speaking Tamil to Rajnikand. Oh yeah. Like that happened even in, in mine where everybody was just like, Oh, that's really unfortunate upon unfortunate. Maybe he was doing Jaangi a favor. Yeah. Boney slipped him like an extra 500 under the table. It could be worse. It could be worse, guys. But what is he supposed to be?

[00:25:45] Like, he's just like a friendly appearance or is he like a kind of a... Yeah. If, yeah, I guess there will be a sequel into the world of Kuli because this is not part of the Lokiverse or the Loki cinematic universe where, you know, the Vikrams and the other movies that Lokesh Kanakaraj is making. This is a different universe in, I suppose, where, but, but yeah, he could probably be making a sequel where Daha or Amir Khan's character is called Daha.

[00:26:13] He could be collaborating with Mr. Kuli. Also, this is like, you know, marked as an Anirudh musical, which seems to be a thing that people do. How's the music? It's boring. Yeah. It's pretty much same old, same old. Okay. Like again, Jailer was like way better. Like that Monica song was just like stupid. Like I didn't really care for it. Like Tamanna song was way better in Jailer.

[00:26:44] Oh, yeah. Okay. Well, disappointing. Yes. Kuli, which seems to be a theme because we're now talking about War 2. I will tell you that I will become my name, my knowledge, my family, and my family will become a family. I will become a family. I will become a family without a family. I will take a gift.

[00:27:13] I will do everything that anyone can do. The things that anyone can fight, that I will fight. Guys, you know, I didn't go with high expectations for this movie. Like I came into it late. All the reviews were out already. I didn't watch the reviews because I usually don't watch the reviews before we record ours. So I had to really, you know, not click on anything.

[00:27:40] But before that, I've been talking to you guys about for weeks. This movie smells like a turd, right? There was something in the glint of Hrithik's squint that I felt that he is not happy with what's happened with this movie. There's not been any promotions. There's not been any noise about it. We didn't even know exactly when it was coming out. So all, and I'm also not such a big Hrithik fan as you guys are maybe, you know, he's

[00:28:07] fine when he's in a good movie, but I'm not like every time, like I'm excited for a Hrithik movie because it's like a 50-50 chance. Like it could be really bad for me, you know? So I come in with really low expectations for a movie and the movie still being able to disappoint me to the point where at the interval point, I'm sending you guys messages that I'm really considering walking out. I didn't think war could be this bad, but it is really, really that bad, unfortunately.

[00:28:38] I'll quickly mention one thing before we dive into it. So Taran Ardarsh, our holy god of reviewers, you know, he's the lord and savior of movie reviews. He basically tweeted a one and a half star review of this movie, which says weakest film in YRF spy universe has star power, scale, style and stunts, but lacks soul. Writing is the biggest culprit here. Not even Hrithik Roshan and NTR can save this royal mess.

[00:29:08] And then YRF, you know, cherry picked those lines and just put has star power, scale, style and stunts and put it on a promo poster as a good review on their war to review posters. It's amazing how Bollywood PR works. Like AI cannot replicate this. I love it. I think this is standard practice though. Like I saw those messages going around. Like I've seen this many times happen in Hollywood movies too.

[00:29:38] Like I think this is just how PR works. And also I didn't know if this was a genuine poster of YRF or it was kind of a joke that they were. No, no. It's from the official Instagram account. Ah, okay. Okay. It was. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No. Cause I remember this thing. First time I saw this was for Tom Hardy movie where he's playing the twin, the craze. Yeah. And they got it in the two stars in between. They put the two stars in between of all of the other stars. That's smart.

[00:30:07] That's smart. That's smart. Yeah. So yeah, I just thought it was interesting. But yeah. Sudha, what did you think of war two? I think you were the most positive out of us. Yeah. I think the timing was fortunate for war two because I had watched coolie earlier and my mind was totally like drained. So I was like happy to accept anything in some logical form. Do you know what I mean? So war two was your coolie after coolie, basically, you know, and you like put in water in your mouth and you spit it out.

[00:30:37] It's just like, Oh, that coolie. Got it. But yeah, it's more gay than war. I would say that. Oh my God. Yes. My God. They literally have a scene where like the two of them are riding off into the sunset. Yeah. I think there were like a lot of moments where the writers are like, this is okay, but make it gay. Like, like that was the note that they kept getting. I did laugh out loud though,

[00:31:07] where Junior India just starts calling him Kabu. I still don't know why that was written. Like why, what was going through the mind of Aditya Chopra when he was just like, you know what? These two should be like friends and he should call him Kabu. Kabu and Rugu. And I'm like, why, why would you do that? Like, I don't, I don't get it.

[00:31:35] And that to be the trigger for the flashback. Oh my God. But the kids were great. Like the, the baby Ragu and baby Kabu were like pretty good. Like, especially baby Ragu, you know, like he was like really, like he really sold it. Yeah. But that was hilarious. But yeah, they sort of rope themselves into a corner because the events of war lead into this Kabir going undercover and exploring the dark side of the world.

[00:32:05] And then him becoming this mercenary. But then how do you escape from that? You need a formidable, you know, antagonist and to have the same sort of equal footing. But Hrithik, to match Hrithik's onscreen presence, you have NTR Jr. who is in a totally different movie in this. So I feel like those expectations were not matched. So that's why the movie was like, I don't know where this, the vernacular of this movie is.

[00:32:35] It felt like masala and mass at the moment. but also they had to shoehorn the spy universe for a bit. And then, yeah, it just felt like so off. I think that's very true. Because the Sid Anand universe of like the spy universe is not a masala universe. It's not like a, like not this kind of like mass masala universe. It's a very sophisticated, you know,

[00:33:04] like only people who have flown in an airplane can appreciate my movies kind of universe. But Ayaan was trying to make a mass masala universe. And the only person that got that memo was Tadak. Yeah. And so he showed up like I, the first, I don't know, few times that I saw him on screen, I was so,

[00:33:30] like it was so jarring to me because it, it was like, I've seen this guy act. I know he can act. Why does it look like he can't act in this movie? And then I realized it's because he is matching the meter of the movie, but the movie is not, which is not like something like any of the others are doing in the movie. So he's basically just sort of left to like hang dry.

[00:33:57] Everybody else is still in the spy universe of war. Do you know what I mean? Everybody's trying to foil a global threat. There's Bond villains and stuff. But whereas Tarek just enters into the movie, he plays a song into the audio jack of the, this, you know, heist he's pulling off. And then he plays the Shaitan soundtrack. And he's like, you know, and all of that. And that's such a, like mass movie entry scene. It's just that, that scene where,

[00:34:26] you know, he's having, I think so getting bored out of our analysis of war too. He was like, I'm listening. I'm fascinating about like, but you guys have really put more thought into the movie than I, like, I have no notes about this as much. No notes. No, I like within the moment. The wolf scene happened and you see the bad CGI.

[00:34:56] Hrithik Roshan wearing Rakesh Roshan's old wigs that they've now cut from the sides. I stopped caring about the movie. Like it was like an instant thing. And I was like, man, I have like the whole movie to do. I was low key expecting when Hrithik Roshan enters into that Japanese Yakuza scene, he would say, I don't mean a nod. There's so many, like you're talking about nods. It could be in there because it feels like this whole movie is about whatever

[00:35:25] Ayaan Mukherjee finds school, you know, like, Oh, I watched Shogun. That's cool. Let's put some Shogun in there. Oh, but I also like ninja. So let's put ninjas in there. And then I also like, you know, pirates of the Caribbean. So let's call the pirate villain Barbosa, you know, and I like Tenet. So I'll get the music, but I like Inception. So let's have a fight scene on this jet. And it's all of these things mishmashed together. And it, I think I may have given this analogy before, but I'll do it again. There's,

[00:35:54] there's a, I'll look straight to Amrita. There's a video game called Street Fighter. You might know it. It's quite popular. And it was a game changer in terms of how video games were made. And the one thing that they did about those, um, in the characters, it's two people fighting against each other is they put weight on the character. So back in the day, when you had two characters fighting, you could just jump as many times as you wanted. It wouldn't matter. They would all jump as the same height, but Street Fighter had different characters. So you had a sumo wrestler.

[00:36:24] He could jump slowly. He wouldn't jump fast. Another, you know, like the girl could jump really, really fast. So they added weight to the characters to make this game feel real. And that's what changed gaming dynamics forever. This movie, the characters have no weight. None of it matters. There is no sense of who's in love with who, who's in supposed to be going out with who, where the allegiances are. Even the dialogues don't matter because either somebody is the ultimate soldier

[00:36:53] or they're the ultimate warrior and they can't decide which one is the ultimate that you should be because Lutra is the warrior, the soldier, and there's nobody like him. He's the soldier that nobody's ever seen. But then Hrithik is the warrior. Then what does that leave Kiara? And what does that leave Pathan and Tiger? Like it makes no sense. It makes no sense. And it's almost becoming harmful to the own. It's harmful to the movie, but it's harmful to this, you know,

[00:37:22] universe that they're trying to create. I know that a lot of people are now saying, you know, it's the end of the universe. And the spy universe is dead. That might happen. But Marvel, when they were doing their universe, it wasn't like a perfect run. You know, they could have like a mid movie in there and still kind of, you know, pull it back together. But I just don't see this happening with the Yash Raj universe. I don't think that they have like a game plan or they didn't even have an understanding of how to build a universe. I mean, they retconned the universe.

[00:37:50] It was never supposed to be a universe. It was just like Tiger. Yeah. but yeah, like also the thing that you're saying about it being sort of cobbled together. That is so true because this movie doesn't have an ending. It has like five different endings, you know, like it has an ending and then it's just like, and then this happened and then that happened. And then this other thing happened. And you're like, what is happening right now? Like, why are we doing this?

[00:38:20] Um, and I was talking earlier about like Kiara, about like the lack of, I mean, the, the infuriating representation of women in Cooley, but that is also kind of true for Kiara's character in this film, because both Taroq and Hrithik get intro scenes, like massive action sequences. Right. Yeah. And then Kiara gets to like walk into a room. Like, I'm like,

[00:38:50] she's a badass soldier. Who's like saving people, blah, blah, blah. Her scene is literally getting a participation medal, by the way. See, that's what she's getting. Yeah. That's literally it. And I'm just like, there's just like the worst thing that I've ever seen. Um, yeah, this movie was just, it wasn't even mid, it was just bad in my opinion. Yeah. Uh, and just with Kiara, I just find it, you know, that meme of Dua Lipa where they go, you know, go girl, give me nothing. That's what I was constantly thinking of.

[00:39:19] I would say it's not because of, Kiara. It's the writing just does not take her into account at all. It's just like, you have a sexy scene with a bikini. You have, you are Lutra's daughter. So you will be able to have some sort of army background and you have some sort of a history with Hrithik, but that's it. That's what we are giving you. The, the old sense of that bikini sequence that I understood is that orange bikini bad, green bikini good. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:39:53] That's what it's saying. But also just like, like, like it doesn't make any sense. It doesn't make any sense that they had a love story 15 years ago, which like when, what, what, how did, how does that fit into anything? And then she's like, Oh, but he also has this affair and this daughter with somebody else. Now suddenly she's this daughter. And then I feel the daughter gets more of a bad-ass entry scene than Kiara does. You know, like, is she known? Is she an influencer that I don't know that I'm too old for, you know? And yeah, it's, it's,

[00:40:22] it's a shame because I don't, Kiara got this. She's always supposed to, she was also supposed to be in Dawn 3. Like she's getting these massive, massive, massive projects, but I don't know why you hire a Kiara Advani. What is she good at that nobody else is good at? And I still haven't figured that out, unfortunately for her. So I do think it's not her fault, but if you are casting her, give her something to shine at least. Right. And in, she's been acting for a while.

[00:40:51] I still haven't seen that from her. Like the only one that I thought was good. She was in was that Karthik Aryan movie, which I'm blanking on the name of, but I thought she was good in that one. Satya Prem Ki Something. Yeah. I thought she was good at that. But yeah. Yeah. Um, Hrithik is really bad in this too. I'll, I'll, I'll be honest. I feel like his shtick, like a lot of times with sequels, it's like, you know,

[00:41:19] just give us what we had and give us more of it. But he just feels like he's sleepwalking. Like he has no engagement with what he's doing. I don't know. Usually like even in a bad movie, I feel Hrithik gives it his all, but here he's like, why am I on a steroid scheme for this movie? Like, that's what it really feels like, you know, like, I don't know. It's like, yeah, it's, uh, it's the same slow motion walk. It's the same looking at the left. Every time he looks to the left,

[00:41:48] it's like the toothpick thing, the bright eyes, reflection on his eyes. And it's like, uh, you know, it's a kind of a, a playbook we've seen so many times and it just done worse. I feel, um, I did find it a few interesting thoughts that I had while watching the movie, though, is the big Kali reveal scene that happens. Kali, Kali, Kali. Sorry. Um, cause it's, uh,

[00:42:16] it's like this international group of neighbors that don't like India and all the countries that India does not have a visa scheme with basically. So, you know, UAE is not involved. Dolan Trump is not involved. Canada is not involved. Britain is not involved. The people that have actual evilness in them, the countries that have an evil engine are not involved, but Myanmar is, you know, like, you know, that kind of thing. So, uh, it,

[00:42:41] it really feeds into this narrative of India surrounded by its enemies, apparently, which like Israel, sometimes I would wonder like, what are you doing? All of your neighbors hate you, you know, sometimes, but anyway, that's beside the point. Um, I also like that all of the Kali villains come into their national dress when they come into this, uh, AI translated, uh, thing that they have on, you know, except for France where it's like some lady,

[00:43:09] like auntie in a sari and a bindi. That's Bangladesh. That's Bangladesh. Was that Bangladesh? Yeah. She's doubting whiskey though. She's doubting whiskey. But wasn't she like murdered in Paris or something? Yeah. She was murdered in Paris. Yeah. But she's not French. Okay. No, no, She's Bangladesh. Yeah. I was really confused. My best take from the Kali conglomerate is that the Indian representative who is called Gautam Gulati. It's such a non-villain name.

[00:43:40] Ayaan Mukherjee just like the alliteration of it. And he's like, our villain will be called Gulati. Yeah. I like that Pakistan has so much to say in an organization named Kali. Like that would happen, you know, like, and at the end, he just, he gets him by eating because he's eating kebabs in Islamabad. I just call them the Kali. Yeah.

[00:44:26] That's how he gets killed. Like why they had to sacrifice Lutra and all of that. It's just, yeah. Yeah. And then at the end of it, it's just like the two of them just being like, you know, like Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid. And they're just like, sort of like going around the place and just going like, okay, we're going to kill these people and we're going to kill those people. I'm like, well, if it was that easy, then why didn't you do it before? And also just such lack of imagination in terms of filmmaking, you know, like I just feel it's like,

[00:44:56] at least if you're giving us like a five minute, you know, sequence of them killing all of these people, make it interesting, make it funny, make it, you know, at least like, wow, visually interesting. And it gives us nothing, you know, like also I just had a problem with like, I don't know if you guys did, but there used to be a cinematic convention where a hero would not be killing children, dogs, and women. Like that's doesn't happen here.

[00:45:22] They're just point blank shooting women left and right in the head. And it's such a weird thing to see cinematically where we become, these are supposed to be Hrithik freaking Roshan. And he's just like point bang, you know, assassinating women in the elevator in Paris. Just find that a really weird cinematic choice, which I, those are the things where I feel there's this kind of like, you know, trolling in cinema in terms of, you know,

[00:45:52] that Ayaan Mukherjee seems to have like, no, not trolling, juvenile, kind of juvenile approach to filmmaking. it's a, it's a lack of, it's a, you know, like there's no center in anything. Like this is my problem with Brahmastra as well, because a lot of people were just like, oh my God, like Brahmastra, I love it. I love it. And I'm like, I never loved it because like as somebody who enjoys fantasy and as somebody who grew up in comic book culture,

[00:46:21] like the thing that really bothered me about Brahmastra is that it had no emotional heart. Had no weight. Exactly the problem that I'm saying. And that is exactly the problem with this as well. Like in the first war, Khaled's death and his life had an emotional weight to it. You know, there was like, he's, he was out there to prove something about his dad and the fact that, you know, somebody stole his identity and like, you know,

[00:46:51] like all of that. And then like Hrithik had to like go out there and like prove that this guy is like a good guy. The fact that his mother still remembers him, like all of that is like, has an emotional weight to it, which like none of the stuff here, like I don't care about Raghu and Kabu at all. Like, you know, like what the hell is that about? No one cares. Also, when you see like the interval happens and you see those flashbacks, the thing I was thinking about is, is Gunde now part of the U, Shiraaj universe?

[00:47:21] Cause this is suddenly very Gunde. Yeah. The movie with, you know, Arjun Kapoor and Ranveer Singh. It was exactly the same thing, you know, two way. Like somebody on our Patreon was asking if the Indian audience just likes man-child cinema. And honestly, I feel like it's not so much the Indian audience. It is that the Indian directors really are living out their man-child fantasies. Yeah.

[00:47:47] And I think when Ayaan was doing things like Wake Up Said and Yeh Jawani Hai Diwani, that was fine. But he's really out of his depth when it comes to movies like Dramastra and Water. But I was wondering about that though. Like, is the blame only on Ayaan though? Because he's surrounded with, dialogues are by Abbas Tairwala, which we were praising in Pathan. There's shit here. Yeah. Right. The screenplay is written by Shridhar Raghavan.

[00:48:17] Amazing writer. He's done so much good work. You know, it's absolute crap here. Produced by Yashraj and Aditya, which we were praising for Sayara, where we were saying they give you everything that you want. The budget is, this is a huge budget, right? Yeah. But then like, where does the blame lie? A lot of it lies with Aditya Chopra, to be very honest. Yeah. Because the whole spy universe thing is Aditya Chopra's baby. And like,

[00:48:47] Ayaan is a hired gun, you know, like, the master was actually Ayaan's baby. And you can like place Balmasra's, you know, blame on his shoulders. Sure. But the spy universe is really Aditya Chopra's baby. And he, I think he has a co-writing credit for this. he does. For war two. And, you know, it's shit. Like, I'm sorry, but like, Aditya Chopra, you know, the last good thing that he wrote was DDLJ.

[00:49:15] And that was apparently written by Honey, and the Chopras basically stole credit. So, I don't know, man. Like, you know, like, Mohawbatin was a drag. Be Fikray was terrible. Bunty or Bubbly 2. Like, why does that even exist? And then, now war two. Again, why? Like, the songs are bad. Like, you know, like, the Britham soundtrack, right? I'm saying, like, they are surrounded by a good team. And that's what a production house can do, right?

[00:49:44] They can put a good team together. He probably, the writing credit is an idea. And then I feel Yashaj does have faith in its filmmakers, right? The people that are making the film. And I think that's where the conception of it is just like, you know, completely bad. But that's also where, like, that's the job of the director, right? Like, the director is the curator. Like, you can have, like, an amazing team. But the director is the guy who, like,

[00:50:12] brings it all together and delivers something that is, like, his perspective. Yeah. And that's what Sudanand is actually good at. Well, I would say, like, I like this movie a lot less now, now that we have had a discussion. But what did you like about it? Like, like, cause we've been, I've been quite negative. I just felt like that the, the sequence of events made sense.

[00:50:41] And that was enough for me on that evening. You know? It's chronological. Yeah. Like, Kuli made no sense, man. Kuli made no sense to my brain. That's true. That's why I was, like, happy that, oh, somebody had coherence in their brain. And somebody was not suffering from, like, short term memory or something when, when they wrote War II. And that worked for me. Uh,

[00:51:08] also like the whole thing when the boys unite at the end, like Kabu and Raghu. And they were like, haa, chalo, abhi hum log abhi linsko maarte hain. And that was like, oh, they, they, they ended on a happy note, you know? And it was like, yeah. I do wish they tied it in with, like, we had a special appearance from Alia for Alpha or, you know, like, even Sharvari. Like, they tied it in in some way instead of them looking at a CGI, you know,

[00:51:37] sunset and talking about Kabir ayega or, you know, like, Tiger ayega, Pathan ayega. And that's it. I did laugh out loud though, when they have like their big, like ice cave, like fight, which was, I'm sorry, but that was like a really cheap moment. Like, you know, they were just trying to recreate the war one aesthetic. And I'm like, you should have just found like another place for them to have like a fight. But anyway, they have their fight. And then,

[00:52:07] like, uh, Hrithik, like he impales Hrithik on, uh, like an iron rod. And then Hrithik, like pulls him in and like, you know, impales him on that same iron rod. And I laughed out loud in the theater because I was like, this is the most like gay thing that I've ever seen in my life. Yeah. I know. I know. Yeah. Yeah. A hundred percent. Like that's definitely a note, you know,

[00:52:37] make it much more romantic, you know? Um, I feel like Ayan is just like, you know, going through Bollywood, just putting topi on all his producers. Um, and he just like did this and he was just like, you know what? None of these boomers will know what I'm doing. Yeah. In my, in my screening when in that whole ice, this cave scene, Hrithik says to, um, Raghu, right. Uh, he says like, I, I wanted to be with you.

[00:53:06] I wanted to grow up to become you. And everybody started laughing. Like Hrithik Roshan is saying that to Tara. Yeah. You wanted to grow up and look like him. Oh my God. Yeah. No, it's, it's really weird. Also the whole idea of making him like the child Kabir, such a weak character. Like it feels weird to then like this becomes such a badass. Like it weakens the Kabir character. Yeah. To see him that way as a young child. I feel, um, no, no, it's, it's, it's a really oddly made movie.

[00:53:34] Did you guys stick around for the end credits? Even like there's a post credit sequence. I only saw the Bobby Deol cameo. Yeah. There's a Bobby Deol cameo. I didn't even see that. I walked away. I think. Oh, there's a, there's an alpha. I didn't know. That's what I was saying. Oh, okay. What's, what happens? You just see Bobby Deol and he's tattooing the Greek alphabet alpha on the, on this little child. And the little girl is like, what are you doing?

[00:54:04] And he's like, uh, you know, there's like one warrior in every village, every town who's like the best. And you're going to be that warrior. Uh, you're going to be the alpha. And she's like, yeah, I'm going to be the alpha. And that's it. Okay. I walked away already. I was like, I just don't care anymore. Unfortunately. Yeah. It's unfortunate. I feel they should have like organically maybe put it in a bit earlier, would have elevated the movie a little bit. Yeah. It's it. Yeah. Any final words on war two?

[00:54:33] Don't watch it. Yeah. It's really bad. Also the climax. Was that shot where they shot, uh, Ritik's mountain du ad? I have no idea what that is. Same thing with the mountain hooks and things like that. Yeah. It's shot in YRF studio. Yeah. It felt, it felt like that. It felt like a very, yeah, unfortunate. Also the VFX in this movie is shit. Like my God, it's shit.

[00:54:58] There's a sequence where you see Kiara where she's proposed and it didn't go away the way she wanted. And she's walking away and then she walks back in. Yeah. And time has passed. Badly done CGI. You can see that the old Kiara is like super imposed on the new shot. It's so badly done. It's really bad. But even like the whole jet sequence, right? Like it again has no weight, like makes no dynamic sense of where,

[00:55:25] like clearly like a lot of these sequences are inspired for something like fast and furious, right? The fast and furious have always maintained a sense of space in the action. You know, every part of what's going where here, none of that makes any sense. Yeah. It's, it's, it's really terrible. So Joe, any final words? Um, I love that Tadak's computer has a UI set up when Hrithik Roshan logs into Instagram. Uh,

[00:55:55] and I like that, uh, you know, they, they are both going on this deadly mission. So why not, you know, dance their way out? Uh, I love that commitment that the pros need to dance out, uh, in a Spanish cafe. They must've been so happy that they found that dance step. They were like, this is it. This is like me, the real, you know, and nobody cared. Nobody cared. Yeah. Oh, I'm sure people will care, you know, like, but, uh, all, uh,

[00:56:24] sponsored by HRX or whatever the sports brand is. Shitty shoe wear is. Um, anyway, Amritha, where can people find you online? Uh, you can find me on Twitter and on blue sky at Amritha IQ, but more and more, you'll find me on Patreon. Khandana Bollywood podcast has its own Patreon and I usually post catch up videos. Um, we have a whole bunch of like behind the scenes stuff and new content every week. So joy,

[00:56:53] you can find me on my socials at 93 K and you can find Khandan podcast on all our socials at Khandan podcast. Drop us an email at you podcasting at gmail.com. Um, and, uh, check out our YouTube essay video. That's already dropped. Uh, the first one, we're ranking all the Salman Khan movies. Um, and there's bunch of YouTube content coming. So follow us, subscribe us, comment there. Uh, YouTube is a new game for us. So we don't know how it works.

[00:57:20] And I think a lot of people have been asking and waiting. Um, so the comments we've gotten have been really positive. So do check it out. I'll add the link in the show and, uh, yeah, that's it for this episode. Thank you for listening. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye.