Is it time to move on from Rohit, Kohli, Ashwin and Jadeja?

[00:00:07] Hello and welcome to this week's episode of the Edges & Sledges Cricket Podcast. We are all together, all three of us are on, on a historic day as New Zealand has just completed a 3-0 whitewash against India at home.

[00:00:25] Varun, you weren't on last week, DJ, and I got to chat and I said, man, after 2-0, it was cathartic to at least relive it. I'm not mentally ready to relive yet another loss.

[00:00:35] And at the end of that episode, we were already talking about Borda, Gavaskar and stuff. And DJ, I think at one point was like, man, have you thought about what happens if we don't win the third test?

[00:00:43] Because even being 2-0 down, we went to the 1k, thinking Team India will win this third test. Varun, did you imagine in your wildest dreams, 0-3 to a New Zealand team who had just lost in Sri Lanka in India?

[00:00:59] No, I was shocked. I was pretty shocked last Saturday when things went down and then Rohit came out and said, you know, we're allowed to lose at home.

[00:01:09] And we've won 12 years in a row, so we're allowed to lose. And I was, I mean, I was shocked with that.

[00:01:16] But I just thought Bombay, they're going to come back, win it. And the beauty about the World Test Championship is you kind of forget about series, right?

[00:01:23] Because where it's at is you're seven months away and you're like, India needs four wins to make it, to not be dependent on other results.

[00:01:31] We've got one in Mumbai, we'll get three in Australia, at least a crack at having three.

[00:01:36] And then this happens and it almost feels like, you know, we haven't played out the scenarios and done the math yet, but it almost feels like a month ago, India and Australia were in the final of this World Test Championship.

[00:01:49] Today, it feels like only one of them is going to be a part of that final.

[00:01:53] And for me personally, just the way India has played in the last month has just been terrible.

[00:02:00] So I have very little hope and faith in the Australia series now. But yeah, let's, we'll get into it.

[00:02:08] DJ, if the glasses have full or every cloud has a silver lining or however you want to say it, this means we have our best chance at not losing a WTC final.

[00:02:18] Yeah, I suppose so if you're not part of it.

[00:02:21] Can't lose if you don't play.

[00:02:24] Yeah, that was hard. It took me a moment to register.

[00:02:27] I've just been in shock for the last two weeks.

[00:02:30] I know, I wish we could have captured the energy you brought to the like 30 seconds before you hit that record button because it's been a tough week while celebrating Diwali to have to come straight off of the highs of that and watch this team.

[00:02:44] Anyway, go ahead.

[00:02:46] Yeah, it's been a tough week. We've lost 0-3.

[00:02:52] And I know Varun, you predicted 3-0, but I'm pretty sure that was in favor of India and not in favor of New Zealand at the start of this test series.

[00:03:00] And of course, Rishabh Pant hasn't been retained by the Delhi capital.

[00:03:04] So I'm not really sure I want to talk about IPL detentions.

[00:03:07] We will eventually, but it's all a very strange week.

[00:03:13] There was a lot of chat before this test about India's preparations to play the spinners.

[00:03:20] At Mumbai, another three-day test match.

[00:03:24] Yes, we lost by 25 runs.

[00:03:27] But really, I mean, if we had somehow managed to pull out yet another miracle, which we did regularly with Akshar and Ashwin and Jadeja coming down the order, remember?

[00:03:36] If we had managed to score those final 25 runs, I don't think the underlying issues, which now have become clear to a lot of Indian fans, which probably weren't clear to a lot of Indian fans, including us, before this series.

[00:03:53] Yeah, we need to ask those questions, which everybody is asking.

[00:03:58] The question around Rohit Kohli, Ashwin Jadeja, Borda Gavaskar World Test Championship final.

[00:04:03] And it's going to be a tough week for Indian cricket fans.

[00:04:08] It's going to be a tough lead into the BGT because you'd expect to have gone into it on a high.

[00:04:12] The whole chat, as you said, was cement your spot in the World Test Championship final and have a bit of fun in Australia.

[00:04:17] Try and get your third Test series win in a row.

[00:04:21] But Ashwin, and I remember I'd mentioned that 2011 was a pretty tough year for Indian cricket.

[00:04:27] And of course, you mocked me for it.

[00:04:31] But we won the World Cup in 2011.

[00:04:32] 2011, we lost the Test Series in England and Australia, 8-0 that year.

[00:04:38] And now we won the World Cup in 2024.

[00:04:41] And we've lost a home Test Series for the first time ever.

[00:04:46] A Test Series more than two Test matches.

[00:04:49] We've been swept.

[00:04:50] We've been clean swept by an unfancied Kane-Williamson-less team.

[00:04:56] Like, I don't know.

[00:04:58] What did we know about Will Young before this Test Series?

[00:05:01] Daryl Mitchell win him as a T20 Chennai Super King player.

[00:05:04] And, like, this is not an expected result for a team of India's stature.

[00:05:09] It's a shocking result.

[00:05:12] Yeah, I mean, you mentioned Will Young, etc.

[00:05:14] Go ahead.

[00:05:15] Daryl Mitchell said, if you all saw it at the post-match, he said, we're just a bunch of Kiwis looking to take on the world, right?

[00:05:23] And that sums up kind of what DJ is saying.

[00:05:26] It's a handful of people who play this sport in New Zealand.

[00:05:30] But they have kind of created havoc in the last 10 years in cricket.

[00:05:35] And this feels to me like the cherry on the cake.

[00:05:39] Yeah, they've especially wreaked havoc on Indian cricket, you can argue, right?

[00:05:43] I mean, in general.

[00:05:44] But especially it feels like Indian cricket has borne...

[00:05:46] 2019 World Cup semi, right?

[00:05:47] It just especially feels like Indian cricket has borne the brunt.

[00:05:50] Varun, let me quickly ask you before we get kind of into the depths of the match, etc.

[00:05:55] Or, yeah, this third match.

[00:05:57] The World Cup championship added that extra context, right?

[00:06:00] But cricket being such a fickle, kind of momentum-driven sport,

[00:06:04] we went from saying, like DJ said, 3-0 ideally against New Zealand,

[00:06:08] and then going to Australia with some buffer.

[00:06:10] We're now sitting here saying 4-0 is at least the minimum you need to win against Australia,

[00:06:16] which is a pipe dream, right?

[00:06:17] Let's call a spade a spade, and 5-0 cement your spot.

[00:06:20] You could have a situation where India beats Australia 4-1

[00:06:23] and still doesn't make the World Cup championship final.

[00:06:25] So the added context has helped.

[00:06:28] Do you think, Varun, there was a layer of added kind of pressure that came with that

[00:06:31] in a series where normally bilateral, three tests at home,

[00:06:35] we should have at least...

[00:06:37] I mean, we should have at least won one of the three.

[00:06:40] So do you think the World Cup championship added that extra pressure?

[00:06:43] I don't think so.

[00:06:44] Not in an India test.

[00:06:46] I think when you went into the series, all of us were saying 3-0.

[00:06:50] We had messages from everyone kind of telling us that,

[00:06:53] so these three Indias won, now what do they need to do?

[00:06:56] And so I think it was more overconfidence than pressure.

[00:06:59] I think the third game as well, like,

[00:07:01] there is just no business for India to have lost 3-0.

[00:07:04] So I still don't think there's the pressure of the World Test Championship that drove this.

[00:07:11] I just think it created a lot of bigger issues.

[00:07:14] And, you know, we should all be reading about these kind of numbers and stats.

[00:07:19] But if you think about it, India's top four have not done anything for four years.

[00:07:26] It has been a disaster.

[00:07:28] It is only at the Rishapant 5, Jaddu and Ashwin 6-7 kind of level that they have saved us time and again.

[00:07:38] And Akshar, like DJ said.

[00:07:39] So the top four for a long time has been a problem.

[00:07:44] Yeah, actually, and since you mentioned that, do you think there's an element?

[00:07:49] This sounds like such a negative thing to say.

[00:07:51] So Varun, I'm going to ask you, because DJ and I chatted this a little last week,

[00:07:54] but do you think there's an element of that 5, 6, 7, 8 have been protecting us?

[00:08:00] Bumrah, bowling, Olly Pope has been, like, all of these moments have saved us or delivered miracles.

[00:08:06] And it didn't today.

[00:08:07] But do you think there's an element of the fact that had Rishap not been given out,

[00:08:10] and we'll talk about this match at the 1K Day, but had he got them across the finish line,

[00:08:14] he would have masked a little bit of how bad.

[00:08:17] I mean, even if Rishap won this match for us, we were 29 for 5 on a day 3 pitch in the 1K Day.

[00:08:22] We have no business doing that.

[00:08:23] Do you think it's the short jump pain we're all feeling today is probably for the medium,

[00:08:28] long-term best that it has forced us to reckon with these questions as a test side?

[00:08:32] I think so, because I do think that change doesn't happen overnight, right?

[00:08:36] Especially not with these kind of stalwart names.

[00:08:39] So, I think what's going to happen is that, very realistically, we are not going to win four tests in Australia, right?

[00:08:48] Yeah, we do win one.

[00:08:50] Realistically, we've never done that.

[00:08:52] I think that's the understatement of the year.

[00:08:56] Yeah, I mean, I think the odds, if I can bet somehow...

[00:08:59] Talk about managing expectations.

[00:09:01] Varu's just, like, corporatize that whole, like...

[00:09:04] Somebody said, by the way, I think I saw it somewhere, if you had bet in New Zealand to beat India 3-0 in India,

[00:09:11] if you had bet $100 or something, you would have been a multi-millionaire.

[00:09:15] Yeah, I mean, it must have been over, like, 90 to 1 odds, I'm guessing.

[00:09:19] I guess we don't want to, like, encourage betting on this podcast, because that's not what we do.

[00:09:23] But at this point, I think, Varu, to your statement, if we had to bet the line on India will not win four tests in Australia,

[00:09:30] I think if I bet $100, I may get $101 back.

[00:09:34] Exactly.

[00:09:34] But what I'm saying is, is that...

[00:09:37] Or 99, actually.

[00:09:39] With that out of the picture, I think you go and you play this, and you try to create a legacy to say,

[00:09:46] we've drawn it, or we've won it three times in a row, and you leave it at that,

[00:09:51] and you slowly start rebuilding the team, because the Australia series is done.

[00:09:55] But come January next year, I think they're going to start rebuilding.

[00:10:00] Now, interesting question to both of you.

[00:10:02] Nobody's talking about Gambhir in any of this.

[00:10:05] Does he just get a free pass because he's new?

[00:10:07] Because I don't recall Shastri and Dravid getting a free pass.

[00:10:12] Or the rumor is, is that he's like, listen, I am just dealing with what's been given to me.

[00:10:19] You give me a free hand, and I will change this lineup, right?

[00:10:23] So it's just interesting.

[00:10:24] I think the question is to draw parallels to our world,

[00:10:28] and I think many of our listeners live in our world.

[00:10:30] It's like, your first year is a new job.

[00:10:31] You kind of...

[00:10:32] You're inheriting what you got.

[00:10:34] You use it as a time to reset the base, as they call you.

[00:10:37] So listen, if it's bad, it's not on me, but then I can start from scratch and build back.

[00:10:42] No, we should talk about the test match, which we will, I'm sure,

[00:10:46] and the 15 minutes of bad cricket on day one that we had to destroy any chance we had to do.

[00:10:51] But, like, maybe we should get into the big question first, right?

[00:10:55] Like, the restructuring of Indian cricket.

[00:10:58] What is it actually going to look like?

[00:11:00] Because if we don't make this World Test Championship final,

[00:11:05] I can't see a long-term future for either Rohit, Kohli, Ashwin, or frankly, even Jadeja in this side.

[00:11:13] I mean, Bumrah is going to be around.

[00:11:15] We should talk that because who are the replacements?

[00:11:19] Do these guys play domestic cricket?

[00:11:22] What is the answer to this?

[00:11:24] Because, like, the top four, as Varun said, have done literally almost nothing.

[00:11:28] I mean, to your question, Ash is 38, Jadeja is 35.

[00:11:32] So Jadeja actually may have a little bit longer left in him.

[00:11:34] But I'm with you.

[00:11:36] There's no long-term left when it comes to Rohit, Kohli, Ash, and Jadeja.

[00:11:39] I think, Varun, to your question, does the road come to an end in January

[00:11:44] when England, I think England comes to India in January?

[00:11:46] Does it end then?

[00:11:47] Or does it end at the end of this World Test Championship cycle, summer?

[00:11:51] I don't think India, I don't think England is coming for tests.

[00:11:54] I mean, we should.

[00:11:55] Oh, yeah.

[00:11:56] Of course.

[00:11:56] Because otherwise your equation would change, right, massively.

[00:12:00] And India had a tour of England this next summer, in 2025.

[00:12:04] After, after.

[00:12:05] After the World Test Championship final.

[00:12:07] Which, I mean, the whole point.

[00:12:08] Yeah, you're right.

[00:12:08] No, they're playing.

[00:12:10] They're playing.

[00:12:10] And then play five tests.

[00:12:11] But you're right.

[00:12:12] So in 5-2-20s, three ODIs, and then India's next scheduled tests are in June.

[00:12:17] So you're right.

[00:12:18] Exactly.

[00:12:19] That's what I'm saying.

[00:12:19] Because you've got Champions Trophy.

[00:12:21] So come Jan 2nd or 3rd, everything's shifting to ODI, right?

[00:12:26] But yeah, so I do think, to DJ's point, I think you've got the Sundars of the world.

[00:12:31] You've got Akshar Patel.

[00:12:32] You've got two guys ready.

[00:12:35] I think.

[00:12:36] And Akshar is younger than Jadeja, right, Ashwin?

[00:12:38] Just, he's a few years younger.

[00:12:40] Five, six years younger, maybe 20.

[00:12:42] I would assume so.

[00:12:43] A hundred percent.

[00:12:44] Let's check his age.

[00:12:46] He's 30.

[00:12:46] Yeah, five years younger.

[00:12:47] And so, yeah, Varun, you could replace like for like the Ash and Jadeja, seven and eight,

[00:12:51] with Akshar and Sundar.

[00:12:52] Exactly.

[00:12:53] And then Kulip is still around as that third option.

[00:12:55] Yeah.

[00:12:56] So that's what I'm saying.

[00:12:57] It's like for like.

[00:12:58] Then I think you're, you've got to watch guys like Sai Sudarshan, right, coming up.

[00:13:04] Iswar, I think it's a thousand opportunities.

[00:13:06] And Sudarshan and the Australia MAH.

[00:13:08] Gil can drop straight to four, which I think is his preferred batting squad.

[00:13:12] Jaeswal is solid.

[00:13:15] Gaikwad is there.

[00:13:18] Padikal has done well, but not enough.

[00:13:20] But what I'm saying is there are guys.

[00:13:22] The problem is just what's going to happen in January.

[00:13:24] Everyone's going to forget about this.

[00:13:25] And then on 15th of June, before the test series in England, they're going to say,

[00:13:30] oh, do we want to go without Kohli and Rohit to England and play in the conditions there?

[00:13:34] And then again, this thing is going to.

[00:13:36] They're going to be showing Kohli six off of 28 of eight needed.

[00:13:41] They're going to be.

[00:13:41] I mean, that's the clip we've been watching and it's been two years.

[00:13:44] Yeah.

[00:13:45] It's great.

[00:13:45] But yeah.

[00:13:46] It is.

[00:13:46] But I mean, there's two ways this could go, right?

[00:13:49] Like one, you go down under.

[00:13:51] Let's be clear.

[00:13:51] Rohit may not play the first test in Australia for family reasons.

[00:13:55] But he will captain in Australia.

[00:13:57] So I can't see an immediate sacking coming on that front.

[00:14:00] Although Bishan Singh Behri, when they kind of last time failed to win a test match like this,

[00:14:05] was sacked and it ended his career.

[00:14:08] He was captain last time this kind of thing happened really.

[00:14:13] So there's two ways.

[00:14:14] One, you win the Borda Gawaskar trophy.

[00:14:17] And with that, I think you save the captaincy of Rohit and the career of Kohli as a batter.

[00:14:24] Test.

[00:14:25] Because we should get into it.

[00:14:27] But there is real pressure now on Kohli at four to deliver those runs.

[00:14:30] It's been three test matches and he hasn't done that.

[00:14:32] But if they lose, then you're basically planning for the next cycle.

[00:14:39] So that's a 2027 cycle, right?

[00:14:44] So I actually can't see us carrying both Rohit and Kohli over the summer if we don't make this World Test Championship final.

[00:14:52] I think.

[00:14:54] Let me ask, and we will get into the match, I promise.

[00:14:57] Varun, let me ask you one more.

[00:14:58] For people who've listened to us for a while know that I tend to draw parallels with the other sport I watch the most, which is tennis.

[00:15:04] This year, going to the Olympics, Novak Djokovic had won everything he was possibly to win, except an Olympic gold medal.

[00:15:12] And you could almost see he left everything out there.

[00:15:14] He kind of didn't, probably didn't deserve to win.

[00:15:16] He left everything out there, got the win.

[00:15:18] And now all the questions are like, great.

[00:15:20] He's still phenomenal as a player, but does he have that motivation left?

[00:15:23] He's got nothing kind of left to prove, nothing left to win.

[00:15:26] It's not, it's maybe the same parallel, but is there an element post the T20 World Cup win?

[00:15:31] Especially when with five overs left, it actually looked like we were going to lose it.

[00:15:35] And we pulled it out and won.

[00:15:37] And that moment where Rohit was lying flat on the ground and Kohli and Rohit hugged.

[00:15:41] Is there a moment, and they retired immediately from the foreman.

[00:15:44] Is there a moment where they just left it out there?

[00:15:46] And now there's, it's hard to like find that motivation again, especially so soon after.

[00:15:51] Yeah.

[00:15:52] Firstly, you talked about Rohit lying on the ground and eating the grass and the mitti.

[00:15:56] Like, he should have been eating the mitti today.

[00:15:58] You should be, you should know what it tastes like.

[00:16:02] Metaphorically, they ate the mitti.

[00:16:04] Because Virilin kicked it in their face.

[00:16:07] Metaphorically, he probably should have been eating some vegetables to slim down a little bit.

[00:16:10] And he couldn't bend over to his sweep.

[00:16:13] Eating mitti when you win, like you should have been like on the ground today.

[00:16:17] But, and I've totally forgot your question.

[00:16:20] I'll just be sure I know it at one.

[00:16:23] I'm not eating.

[00:16:25] No, but I think the pressure…

[00:16:27] Is the motivation gone?

[00:16:29] Like, is it hard to…

[00:16:29] Even Dravid said, right, you got one left to Kohli, right?

[00:16:33] Because Kohli has won everything else.

[00:16:36] I just, surprisingly, I do think that this team is better suited to Australian pitches

[00:16:43] than Indian pitches today, right?

[00:16:45] True.

[00:16:45] It just, it just feels like that.

[00:16:47] So, I'm just, I'm not…

[00:16:48] My statement really was not do it gloom.

[00:16:51] I was just saying we're not going to win four.

[00:16:52] But it doesn't mean we can't win and we can't do well.

[00:16:56] But it is looking like the end of the road because, to me, what this milestones of like

[00:17:02] finals and stuff have done is it's given you opportunities to rebuild, right?

[00:17:06] It's given players opportunities to assess, do I want to be here?

[00:17:09] This is what's happening even with the IPL option that we'll talk about.

[00:17:11] Like, can you commit to being in the cycle for three years and giving it your 100%

[00:17:16] and then I will retain you, right?

[00:17:17] That's, that's what these things do.

[00:17:19] As a player, I think, I mean, Kohli is going to believe till the day he dies that he can

[00:17:25] hit another six of Haris Rauf, right?

[00:17:27] Like, if 80-year-old Kohli is playing against 80-year-old Haris Rauf, you know, he's going

[00:17:32] to bet on his core strength to do that.

[00:17:34] But at some point, you just have to walk away.

[00:17:37] Yeah, and let's get into the match.

[00:17:39] But DJ, just last quick stat I'll share, because you mentioned kind of, it's been trending

[00:17:45] downwards, right?

[00:17:45] It's not that we've been playing phenomenally and then woke up one day and we had a bad

[00:17:50] series.

[00:17:50] It wasn't 15 minutes of bad cricket.

[00:17:52] It's a cumulative 15, 20, 30, 45 minutes of bad cricket that keep kind of adding on.

[00:17:58] But I looked up and Kohli has 29 test centuries.

[00:18:02] 27 of them came before 2019.

[00:18:07] Right?

[00:18:07] In the last five years, counting 20, where there was limited test cricket, he only played

[00:18:10] three tests then.

[00:18:12] He scored two tests, two centuries, both of which came last year.

[00:18:16] His average is 48.32.

[00:18:20] But in 2020, his average was 19.

[00:18:22] In 21, it was 28.

[00:18:24] Then it was 26.

[00:18:26] Then last year, he had a better year, averaged 55.

[00:18:28] And this year so far, in 10 innings, his average is 27.

[00:18:32] So you're seeing it, right?

[00:18:33] If you average 48 over your career and you have averaged in the 20s three of the last

[00:18:38] four years or below four of the last five years, it's just not there anymore.

[00:18:42] Yeah, but it's also a function of he didn't get...

[00:18:45] So I don't want to make excuses for him, right?

[00:18:46] Because he's had an awful series.

[00:18:48] And frankly, his dismissal in the first innings here, I don't think I've seen a worst dismissal

[00:18:56] from Kohli for a really long time.

[00:18:58] He missed a bloody full toss on the second test match.

[00:19:00] And I still think that this is worse than that.

[00:19:02] Getting run out in the last five minutes of the day.

[00:19:05] Ridiculous.

[00:19:07] It's been a function of the pitches he's played on that he's ordered in some cases from 2021

[00:19:12] onwards.

[00:19:13] They've been square turners.

[00:19:15] And I don't know whether anybody's really done well on those tracks, to be honest.

[00:19:19] He missed out on the five best, four best batting tracks of this year when he didn't play

[00:19:25] against England because of family reasons, of course.

[00:19:28] The problem with all of this is, right?

[00:19:30] So where do you see this changing?

[00:19:32] Where is Kohli going to go back?

[00:19:33] And let's get into it.

[00:19:34] We should talk about each of them.

[00:19:36] We should talk about Rohit.

[00:19:37] I don't know concerns for me from Jaiswala and Gil because they've actually been the saving

[00:19:41] grace here.

[00:19:42] But Rohit and Kohli both.

[00:19:43] Kohli, I want to talk about because what is the solution to this?

[00:19:47] Does he go back to Ranji Trophy Cricket and fix the problem against spin?

[00:19:52] Because there is a problem against spin.

[00:19:54] He's getting out to spin.

[00:19:55] And getting out to mediocre spinners in some cases.

[00:19:58] Like a Mitchell Santner and a Ajax Patel should not be getting one of who's supposed to be

[00:20:02] one of the better batters in the world out, right?

[00:20:06] He's not going to go back to domestic cricket.

[00:20:09] Let's be clear about it.

[00:20:10] I don't think he has the time or the energy to do that.

[00:20:14] So if that's going to be the case, you're only committing to play abroad, basically.

[00:20:21] And so that's where it turns for me.

[00:20:22] Are you going to score the runs in Australia, which you have?

[00:20:25] He scored four centuries in one tour once.

[00:20:27] He scored a hundred at Perth once.

[00:20:29] Are you going to score the runs in England?

[00:20:31] Yeah, but the home problem doesn't go away.

[00:20:33] So people that are scoring runs at home should be given a shot there, right?

[00:20:36] Because you can't carry superstars forever.

[00:20:39] You can't let them...

[00:20:42] And I'm a big Kohli fan, man.

[00:20:43] But there is something going on.

[00:20:46] The way he got run out desperately in the first innings sent a signal to me which was like,

[00:20:53] there is something not right there.

[00:20:56] Varun, can I just ask you...

[00:20:57] We're not going to go through this whole match.

[00:20:59] A, it's too painful.

[00:21:00] B, we want to talk about the existential questions.

[00:21:01] But let me just ask you about, on day one of a test match, when you dismissed New Zealand for 235-ish,

[00:21:09] Rohit got out.

[00:21:10] Rohit just...

[00:21:11] Before Wiccats fell to pace this whole test match, two of them were Rohit to Matt Henry.

[00:21:15] He just...

[00:21:16] He can't seem to help himself.

[00:21:17] But fine.

[00:21:19] Jeswal then, with...

[00:21:20] I think it was like two or three...

[00:21:21] Two-ish overs left in the day.

[00:21:24] I mean, again, I've made this joke before.

[00:21:26] I'm a terrible cricket player myself.

[00:21:27] But even I know that when the ball is coming kind of outside your leg stump, it's a great ball for a sweep.

[00:21:34] Ball bounced, pitched outside his leg stump, and he was reverse sweeping.

[00:21:37] So an absolutely horrendous premeditated shot.

[00:21:39] Again, for a guy who's had a decent series.

[00:21:41] Gets bowled.

[00:21:42] Varun, Mahmoud Saraj walks in at two down.

[00:21:48] And first baller.

[00:21:49] Not only does he get out LBW,

[00:21:52] he's hitting the bottom part of the middle stump.

[00:21:56] Anyways, to review for height.

[00:21:58] He was like...

[00:21:59] Yes, it hit him above the knee roll.

[00:22:01] But he was so far forward that his knee was almost at the ground.

[00:22:04] Like his back knee.

[00:22:06] Anyway, just...

[00:22:08] Was that just telling about our whole side right now?

[00:22:10] So the whole thing was telling, right?

[00:22:12] The first thing you mentioned is Jeswal's reverse sweep.

[00:22:17] And there's two of us left.

[00:22:18] Guys, you just gotta be better, right?

[00:22:20] Given what has happened in the last three weeks, just be better.

[00:22:25] Be more aware.

[00:22:27] And another thing is, you know, game awareness.

[00:22:30] Since I just mentioned the word awareness.

[00:22:31] Like Akash Deep in that second inning,

[00:22:33] when Washington Sundar was batting.

[00:22:35] And we had a lead of 30 odd.

[00:22:38] We needed another 20,

[00:22:39] which by the way was the difference between the two sides.

[00:22:42] Akash Deep is turning and going for a double, right?

[00:22:45] Like zero game awareness.

[00:22:48] So I think Jeswal needs to work on that.

[00:22:51] And Jeswal, I think, hasn't realized yet

[00:22:52] how important he is to this side.

[00:22:54] Because he's young, right?

[00:22:56] He's like, I'm a...

[00:22:58] Yeah.

[00:22:59] And so from the day he debuted in Feb to today,

[00:23:02] he is like a tenured top six.

[00:23:07] I mean, is he the second name in your top six today after Rishabh?

[00:23:11] Yeah, yeah.

[00:23:11] He definitely is.

[00:23:12] He's actually the first name for me.

[00:23:16] I mean, I don't think you put him ahead of Rishabh.

[00:23:18] I mean, not Batting order.

[00:23:20] He's the first name, of course.

[00:23:23] The first name is Bhumra.

[00:23:25] Yeah, but even Siraj is in the top six nowadays.

[00:23:28] Yeah.

[00:23:28] But anyway, coming to Siraj,

[00:23:31] again, it's a mindset thing, right?

[00:23:33] Like Kohli was standing there, padded up.

[00:23:35] I don't know if you guys saw.

[00:23:36] He was standing there.

[00:23:38] And Gambhir is like, you know, signals to Kohli.

[00:23:42] And it wasn't about chole culture or anything.

[00:23:45] Like it's not something for Kohli to get excited about.

[00:23:47] He just signaled to Siraj to go in.

[00:23:50] Wait, I missed that.

[00:23:51] Is that pretty clear that that was a Gambhir call

[00:23:53] and not a Rohit or Kohli call?

[00:23:54] Yeah, it looked very interesting.

[00:23:56] I don't want to blame Gambhir for this.

[00:23:58] Sure, sure, sure.

[00:23:59] It looked like a Gambhir call.

[00:24:00] Why?

[00:24:00] We want to blame someone.

[00:24:02] We have to find some mujrims of this match.

[00:24:06] And so Gambhir sent Siraj out,

[00:24:08] which by the way is a lame decision.

[00:24:10] But it shows you his mind space.

[00:24:12] He's like, if Kohli gets out today, we've lost this game.

[00:24:16] And that's exactly what happened.

[00:24:18] It's just these moments of chaos.

[00:24:20] We've lost, I think, six runs for an average of 30 runs,

[00:24:25] like four or five times this season.

[00:24:28] And that's the collapse, right?

[00:24:30] So yeah, I think Siraj was just in disbelief that he got out.

[00:24:36] And I don't know.

[00:24:37] It just showed me the mindset of the team.

[00:24:39] I just don't think there's a place for a Nightwatchman number 11 anymore.

[00:24:43] Like, it would have been a different decision to say,

[00:24:44] send Ash up the order.

[00:24:46] Or send Jadeja up the order to have...

[00:24:49] Well, I guess...

[00:24:49] I've just had a thought.

[00:24:51] Like, do you think Siraj said,

[00:24:53] yeah, if you're not giving him bowling,

[00:24:55] if you're batting,

[00:24:55] do you think that's what happened?

[00:24:57] It was like something.

[00:24:58] I want to do something.

[00:24:59] He did nothing the whole test series.

[00:25:02] Yeah.

[00:25:04] I mean, that's the only logical explanation, right?

[00:25:06] Like, you're like, no, I'm going to bat.

[00:25:07] Like, what?

[00:25:09] Like, Australia has done away with the Nightwatchman.

[00:25:12] England have a guy that hits sixes as a Nightwatcher or whatever,

[00:25:16] the Nighthawk or whatever they call them.

[00:25:18] And we are sending Siraj Bhai,

[00:25:20] who's not only getting out on the first ball,

[00:25:22] but eating a review alongside...

[00:25:24] Yeah, what frustrates me is you only have two guys in this team

[00:25:27] who can't really bat.

[00:25:28] You could have sent anybody from five through nine ahead of Kohli

[00:25:31] if your goal was to protect Kohli

[00:25:33] and just change your batting order a little.

[00:25:35] But you chose to send a number 10.

[00:25:38] And, of course, he got out.

[00:25:39] Anyway, DJ, last thought on that,

[00:25:41] on this passage of play.

[00:25:42] You and I talked a lot about how

[00:25:44] Virat and Pant in the second test,

[00:25:47] the ball goes behind Virat,

[00:25:49] Pant at the non-striker center.

[00:25:50] It is Pant's call.

[00:25:51] Virat set off, Pant didn't send him back.

[00:25:53] And there's a little bit of who's going to send Virat back

[00:25:55] when he calls for a single and all that.

[00:25:58] Fine.

[00:25:58] Pant got run out, not great.

[00:26:00] This time, ball goes to mid-on.

[00:26:02] Right?

[00:26:03] Virat hits the ball to mid-on.

[00:26:05] Early, I think it was his fourth ball or something.

[00:26:08] And he sets off.

[00:26:09] He just hit a full toss for...

[00:26:11] So he'd got...

[00:26:11] The danger ball had been dealt with.

[00:26:13] He'd actually hit it to the fielder.

[00:26:15] The fielder drove over it.

[00:26:16] I think O'Rourke.

[00:26:18] He was hit and the fielder drove over it.

[00:26:20] Kohli was like,

[00:26:20] Yeah, I've dealt with the danger ball.

[00:26:23] Man, the next ball, I think,

[00:26:24] is one of the lowest points.

[00:26:25] So he hits it to mid-on and sets off for a single.

[00:26:28] It's nobody to blame except him.

[00:26:30] All you're trying to do is get through.

[00:26:32] I mean, if you're not trying to just get through to the close of play,

[00:26:35] you wouldn't have sent Siraj.

[00:26:36] Right?

[00:26:36] You can't have those both ways.

[00:26:38] If your goal is not just to try to get to the end of day one,

[00:26:40] you wouldn't have sent Siraj.

[00:26:42] And so it's like,

[00:26:43] Is Kohli just...

[00:26:44] Is this in his head?

[00:26:45] Is it a little bit of...

[00:26:47] I want to say it's a little bit of...

[00:26:49] I think I'm still as fit as I was when I was 25.

[00:26:51] I can take him on.

[00:26:52] But I don't think he was slow.

[00:26:53] I don't think he's slowed down in terms of speed.

[00:26:56] I don't think five years ago Kohli would have made that.

[00:26:58] It was just an objectively bad call.

[00:27:00] It's a non-existent run.

[00:27:02] Yeah.

[00:27:02] It's because of the pressure.

[00:27:05] It's all the stuff that's gone on before.

[00:27:07] Siraj going in.

[00:27:08] Then he has to anyway go in the next ball.

[00:27:11] It's just stuff.

[00:27:13] And he's dealt with that long hop or full toss.

[00:27:18] I think Ravindra was bowling.

[00:27:19] Ravindra bowled him a full toss.

[00:27:20] He hit it through mid-wicket.

[00:27:22] And then, yes, he's fit.

[00:27:25] But that's not a run that one of the...

[00:27:29] You can't see Steve Smith or, I don't know,

[00:27:31] Kane Williamson or...

[00:27:35] Baba Razam's drop.

[00:27:36] You can't see...

[00:27:37] Maybe it's a Baba Razam type of move.

[00:27:39] Like, your team is completely on top.

[00:27:42] You're one of the best batters in the world.

[00:27:44] You need to score first innings runs

[00:27:45] because that is where that test match had to be won.

[00:27:48] You've lost two wickets in the last five minutes.

[00:27:51] It's a bonkers run to try and take.

[00:27:53] It's just...

[00:27:54] Who am I to tell Kohli about running between the wickets?

[00:27:57] But you're involved in two runouts in the last two games.

[00:28:00] Like, something scrambled there.

[00:28:02] Like, what are you trying to do?

[00:28:04] It's not like you're trying to, like, change the field

[00:28:07] or get an advantage, bring the field in.

[00:28:09] You're not trying to rotate the strike.

[00:28:10] You're not trying to do any of those things.

[00:28:12] You're just trying to get through to the end of day's play.

[00:28:14] And either you...

[00:28:16] That's a leg stump half-fall and you flick it through mid-wicket for four,

[00:28:19] which is...

[00:28:19] Kohli of old would have probably done that.

[00:28:21] Or...

[00:28:21] You just block it and you say no.

[00:28:24] Like...

[00:28:24] Yes, it was a magnificent piece of fielding.

[00:28:26] Let's get...

[00:28:27] Not get that right.

[00:28:28] Like, Matt Henry picked it up.

[00:28:30] One...

[00:28:31] One...

[00:28:31] But...

[00:28:32] What a bonus.

[00:28:33] Wicked...

[00:28:34] It's not like he's batting with the tail.

[00:28:36] Shuman Gill is at the other end, right?

[00:28:38] Like...

[00:28:38] It's nonsense.

[00:28:39] And I saw that again.

[00:28:40] He hesitated before taking the run.

[00:28:43] Like, he took a step...

[00:28:44] Shuman.

[00:28:45] Yeah.

[00:28:46] And when he saw Kohli go, he said, okay, it's your call, Matt.

[00:28:49] It's your call, right?

[00:28:50] Paul's behind me.

[00:28:51] It's so frustrating.

[00:28:52] And it's one of the worst...

[00:28:54] I've seen Kohli get run out before.

[00:28:56] We've seen Kohli and Rohit get run out before, ending up at the same end.

[00:28:59] We've seen Kohli and Adelaide get run out by Rahane.

[00:29:02] Not Kohli's fault.

[00:29:03] We've seen him run Rishabh Pantahudala.

[00:29:05] Those are all kind of...

[00:29:07] You get it.

[00:29:08] This was...

[00:29:09] It's just a lack of match away.

[00:29:12] It's what you've said.

[00:29:13] It's a lack of...

[00:29:14] But it can't be a lack of match away.

[00:29:16] He's played like 500 games.

[00:29:18] Like, it's a brain fade in that moment.

[00:29:21] And it's that constant brain fade that...

[00:29:25] You're not going to win test matches if you're giving away top four wickets like that.

[00:29:29] It was a shocking way to lose a test match wicket.

[00:29:32] Let alone one of the wickets that you think is going to, like, give you first innings runs.

[00:29:37] I mean, that was a low point for me as a Kohli fan.

[00:29:40] If the Haris Rao 6 that we've talked about is a high point, man.

[00:29:43] Like, this was a real, real low point.

[00:29:47] And his dive...

[00:29:49] It wasn't the full dive.

[00:29:51] I feel like he dived, but he didn't...

[00:29:53] He dived late.

[00:29:55] He dived late.

[00:29:55] You don't expect this guy to pick it up and fling it and hit the stumps.

[00:29:59] This is New Zealand, right?

[00:30:01] Have you seen...

[00:30:02] Barring like one hour yesterday, their fielding has been top notch.

[00:30:07] But that's the whole point.

[00:30:08] You know what?

[00:30:09] You lost the Test Series 2-0.

[00:30:10] You won the Test Series 2-0.

[00:30:12] It would have been okay for them to switch off.

[00:30:15] I cannot see an England or Australia playing a third Test match with this intensity.

[00:30:20] Ajaz Patel, a gentle guy, is giving people a send-off.

[00:30:25] They're flinging themselves.

[00:30:27] This Test match hurts more because it was not like New Zealand took their foot off the gas.

[00:30:34] Right?

[00:30:35] It hurts more because India tried and could not beat New Zealand playing at their best.

[00:30:41] Yeah.

[00:30:42] New Zealand didn't say, we're going to say, we're 2-0 up.

[00:30:44] Let's chill.

[00:30:45] Let's try some new guys, like rotate in the squad.

[00:30:48] Yeah, but we rested Bumrah, right?

[00:30:49] So, we should talk about this.

[00:30:51] Why have we rested Bumrah?

[00:30:53] All right.

[00:30:53] I don't have an issue with that.

[00:30:55] Okay.

[00:30:55] Just my gut feel.

[00:30:56] But he's played three-day Test matches.

[00:30:58] He's not tired.

[00:31:00] But he has no role to play.

[00:31:02] Yeah.

[00:31:02] In a match where 36 of the 40 wickets went to spin and the two of the quick ones were Rohit

[00:31:07] giving free wickets to Matt Henry.

[00:31:09] Let's be clear.

[00:31:09] I'm not sure Bumrah would have been the...

[00:31:11] Then play eight batters and three spinners.

[00:31:13] So, kia hai?

[00:31:13] Team combination as a car offer?

[00:31:15] Yeah.

[00:31:15] That I agree with.

[00:31:16] I agree with going with one pacer.

[00:31:19] But I think you're right about the New Zealand thing.

[00:31:21] I just want to say also credit to them.

[00:31:23] Every game, they had somebody different who stood up.

[00:31:26] Yeah.

[00:31:26] Yeah.

[00:31:27] Every game.

[00:31:28] And they were like fighting for their life here.

[00:31:31] Like, and it was not for a World Test Championship spot.

[00:31:34] They just had a point to prove.

[00:31:36] I think they realized we're making an inroad.

[00:31:39] And just, you know, probably last point is when we were thinking about the target,

[00:31:43] I remember messaging people saying 200 is a loss.

[00:31:48] 150 is 50-50.

[00:31:50] And I think 120 is ours.

[00:31:52] That's literally what I said.

[00:31:54] And it came down to that 50-50.

[00:31:56] But it was, it's going to be hard.

[00:31:59] It's just, I can't even imagine if we were chasing 150 on day five, what would have happened?

[00:32:04] This is day three.

[00:32:06] It was unacceptable.

[00:32:07] 150 being 50-50 changes drastically when you get to 29 for five.

[00:32:11] DJ, I'm going to take us to a very quick break.

[00:32:14] We will come back, finish talking about this and the future of Team India.

[00:32:17] And then Varun, energy permitting, we'll have you talk a little bit about IPL retentions.

[00:32:21] Don't go anywhere.

[00:32:22] We will be right back after this break.

[00:32:32] Welcome back to the Edges and Sledges Cricket Podcast.

[00:32:34] This is a tough episode to record, but it's tough.

[00:32:36] I'm glad we're all here.

[00:32:37] If you're on YouTube with us, leave us a comment.

[00:32:39] We're reading the live chat, but we're also, you know, going to read comments later.

[00:32:43] Hit that like button.

[00:32:44] Hit that subscribe button.

[00:32:45] So we can keep making more depressing episodes like this.

[00:32:49] Varun, you talked about the chase.

[00:32:51] Let me first ask you, and honestly, I don't have too much I want to say about the fact that

[00:32:55] we got to 29 for five.

[00:32:56] I don't want to get into specifics too much.

[00:32:59] Breshabh recovered us potentially.

[00:33:01] We talked about this a little.

[00:33:02] Let me just look at the total match then.

[00:33:05] Gil, 90 in the first innings.

[00:33:08] Yeah, shoulder and the ball, shoulder and his arms to a ball that just went out straight

[00:33:11] onto the stumps is not great.

[00:33:13] But in the context of a low-scoring match, Gil, Jaiswal looked decent in the first innings

[00:33:18] before playing a bad shot.

[00:33:20] And then Rishabh Pant, 250s.

[00:33:23] No major complaints about these guys, right?

[00:33:25] A little bit more on what you want them to be doing.

[00:33:28] And yes, 90s should become 100s.

[00:33:29] And yes, for Rishabh, 60s should become 80s and 90s.

[00:33:32] But overall, not complaining too much, right?

[00:33:36] No, you're not.

[00:33:37] Because then you're saying I have to change my whole lineup, right?

[00:33:39] Like I said, Jaiswal has the potential.

[00:33:41] Just needs to be a little more aware.

[00:33:43] Like, I don't think our top order should be giving wickets to Glenn Phillips, right?

[00:33:46] Just nothing against Glenn Phillips, but I don't think we should.

[00:33:50] By the way, did you guys see him field?

[00:33:52] Like, he runs across the turf as if...

[00:33:57] Like, he makes Jadeja look slow.

[00:33:59] Anyway.

[00:34:00] But Gil, I was a little shocked by in that second innings.

[00:34:04] That was just totally unexpected.

[00:34:06] To me, that changed the momentum.

[00:34:09] Like, when your premier Prince matchman has misread this, to me, that was shocking.

[00:34:16] But man, Rishabh Pant, like I got a message saying,

[00:34:21] Heera hai bhai, Heera.

[00:34:22] Like, he's a diamond.

[00:34:24] And that's just what it is.

[00:34:25] Like, this format is built for Rishabh Pant.

[00:34:28] And Rishabh Pant is built for this format.

[00:34:30] It is just a story that we want to watch.

[00:34:35] But I, you know, in the past, I was questioning why is he at five.

[00:34:38] I get it.

[00:34:39] He's so important now that you don't want him to be batting with the tape.

[00:34:43] You don't want him to be farming strike.

[00:34:45] I think, if you ask my honest opinion,

[00:34:48] the Aussies are basically going to have 90% of their plan to deal with Rishabh Pant

[00:34:53] and 10% to deal with Jaiswal.

[00:34:55] If they get these two plans sorted, this series is done.

[00:35:00] DJ, very important question.

[00:35:02] Do we still get to call him Prince,

[00:35:04] given that he is allegedly no longer dating Sajjan's daughter?

[00:35:07] Does that make him not the Prince of Indian cricket anymore?

[00:35:10] I'm not going to get into that.

[00:35:12] But if the king is changing and the dynasty is ending,

[00:35:17] I mean, I'm not sure.

[00:35:20] Maybe he is a new king.

[00:35:22] King Gill.

[00:35:24] I don't know, man.

[00:35:25] A little bit early for that.

[00:35:27] No, I mean, he played a knock of 90.

[00:35:30] Yeah, it would have been better to be 100.

[00:35:31] But man, that was worth like a lot.

[00:35:34] You were 86 for 4.

[00:35:36] You were staring another…

[00:35:39] You're looking at another 150 all out in that scenario.

[00:35:43] And to play that knock against that attack in those conditions,

[00:35:46] that's worth like 150 on a placid batting track.

[00:35:50] It was…

[00:35:51] I thought he was excellent.

[00:35:52] I thought that knock, again, another coming-of-age knock, I felt.

[00:35:57] And he must be 24 now.

[00:36:01] But he's…

[00:36:02] I think between him and Jaeswar, I keep ping-ponging every week.

[00:36:05] I think this guy is going to be the future captain.

[00:36:07] They're 23 and 24 or something like that, right?

[00:36:10] Yeah, he just turned 25, yeah.

[00:36:11] Yeah, I thought he played a great knock.

[00:36:18] But you've got to look to the future.

[00:36:20] And he is going to be that number four spot soon.

[00:36:24] He is going to relish batting on those Australian tracks.

[00:36:27] We can never forget that whatever 91 he got at the Gabba, right?

[00:36:31] That set us up.

[00:36:32] Yes, we remember the Rishabh Panthia names,

[00:36:34] but that was what actually made us believe originally.

[00:36:37] So, this series, the Boda Gavaskar Trophy,

[00:36:42] which is starting in a few weeks, right?

[00:36:43] Yeah.

[00:36:44] Which is good.

[00:36:46] I think this is going to be the transition.

[00:36:49] The transition has started now.

[00:36:51] Let's be very clear about the transition starting.

[00:36:54] This is us having to think beyond Rohit Kohli.

[00:36:58] And I think Ashwin and Jadeja, to my mind.

[00:37:00] And they've been great servants of Indian cricket.

[00:37:03] Ashwin, after you mentioned,

[00:37:04] I read the Sid Monga article about the generation that set up

[00:37:08] that incredible 18 series streak.

[00:37:10] And he says as well, at the end,

[00:37:12] we've got to get ready for this transition.

[00:37:13] And it's coming.

[00:37:14] But I think Gil needs to move on to answer your original question.

[00:37:17] Move on from being the prince to actually being the king.

[00:37:20] So, this Australia series,

[00:37:23] where you saw Kohli transition from Dhoni's understudy

[00:37:26] into 400s in four test matches,

[00:37:30] those Adelaide knocks, all of that.

[00:37:31] He came of age in Oz.

[00:37:34] And now it's time for Shuman Gil.

[00:37:35] I think this is the Jaiswal and Gil show

[00:37:38] that we're going to see in the Bordogavaskar Trophy.

[00:37:40] And I'm excited about it.

[00:37:41] I'm sad.

[00:37:42] Because Rohit and Kohli are obviously our guys in a way.

[00:37:47] 2018, Ashwin, is when we started this podcast.

[00:37:50] And 2018 was the year that Kohli averaged 55 in test cricket.

[00:37:54] He scored 1,300 plus runs.

[00:37:57] 22 of those test matches were outside India, Australia, South Africa, and England.

[00:38:04] So, but with all good things, I think you've got a plan for the future.

[00:38:09] So, they will come to an end.

[00:38:10] And I think he needs to transition from being the prince to the king soon.

[00:38:14] Yeah, I mean, listen, nothing else to add there.

[00:38:18] Except Varun, DJ mentioned we're starting in three weeks in the Bordogavaskar Trophy.

[00:38:23] Did you realize we're in between that?

[00:38:25] We are touring South Africa for some T20s?

[00:38:27] I didn't realize that till earlier today.

[00:38:30] I mean, I saw the ads on TV while watching the match.

[00:38:34] Yeah, it's a bit surprising.

[00:38:36] It's crazy.

[00:38:36] It's a totally different squad though.

[00:38:38] Yeah.

[00:38:38] Sky, Tila, Khardik, Akshar, Sandhu, Jitesh, Varun Chakravarti, Arshadip.

[00:38:44] Like a completely different squad.

[00:38:45] So, Akshar is just collecting points.

[00:38:48] Yeah.

[00:38:49] Akshar is the only one who is doing it.

[00:38:51] Yeah, correct.

[00:38:51] I think Akshar is the only guy who's flying.

[00:38:54] But also, he's not probably going to play the first test, right?

[00:38:57] So, that's the other thing.

[00:38:59] But yeah, look, it'll be fun.

[00:39:00] It'll be the kind of action that we've been used to for this year.

[00:39:04] And I think, yeah, Sky and team will make us forget this quickly.

[00:39:09] Let's hope so.

[00:39:10] Will we forget this quickly?

[00:39:12] I can't forget this quickly.

[00:39:12] I mean, we have to.

[00:39:13] This is hard, man.

[00:39:15] We just move on, man.

[00:39:16] It's how it goes.

[00:39:16] I mean, even I said this because after 2-0, I was still like, okay, cool.

[00:39:20] So, 2-1 will be a good finish.

[00:39:21] 2-1, yeah.

[00:39:23] 0-3.

[00:39:25] Like, that's…

[00:39:27] It's unbelievable.

[00:39:28] It's never happened before.

[00:39:29] It's unprecedented.

[00:39:30] Yeah.

[00:39:31] Varun, by the way, the guy who tormented us,

[00:39:33] I realized, Ajaz Patel in 2021 in the 1K day has only played,

[00:39:37] I think, seven tests since then.

[00:39:40] They played him once in Lords.

[00:39:41] He got no wickets.

[00:39:42] And then after that, he is exclusively playing in the subcontinent.

[00:39:45] 2 Pakistan, 3 Bangladesh and 2 Sri Lanka, I think, is what he's playing.

[00:39:49] I mean, I think he should just move here and just practice here.

[00:39:52] What's the part of practicing in Dizina?

[00:39:53] He was born in Bombay.

[00:39:55] Do you know that?

[00:39:55] Or Mumbai.

[00:39:56] Yeah.

[00:39:57] Insane.

[00:39:58] All right.

[00:39:59] DJ talked a lot about Gil.

[00:40:00] Varun, let me ask you.

[00:40:01] I know DJ is a big fan.

[00:40:03] So let me ask you.

[00:40:03] Washington Sundar.

[00:40:05] Probably one of the silver linings or good outcomes of the series.

[00:40:08] Good with the ball.

[00:40:09] Picked up four records in the first things.

[00:40:10] Great with the bat and instances he got to play.

[00:40:12] I think we have to figure out his role with the bat a little more.

[00:40:14] But another one of the crop that is 24, 25 years old

[00:40:18] and fairly experienced for being that age.

[00:40:20] Do you think he's sort of cemented his spot in a post-Ashwin Jadija world, at least?

[00:40:25] I think so.

[00:40:26] I think the thing is, he's just been missing for so long.

[00:40:31] Like, I was watching this with somebody and they're like, who's Washington Sundar?

[00:40:36] Right?

[00:40:37] And I was like, what?

[00:40:39] And they were like, yeah, I said, what do you mean he played in the Gamma test?

[00:40:43] And they're like, oh, that was four years old.

[00:40:43] Were you watching this with your daughter who's two years old?

[00:40:45] No, no.

[00:40:46] I think she knows who Sundar is.

[00:40:49] Is it time for you to get her a dog named Gamma?

[00:40:51] Yeah, that would be fun.

[00:40:53] That would be great.

[00:40:54] Or Wang Kede.

[00:40:55] Yeah.

[00:40:55] Anyway.

[00:40:56] But I think the thing is, like, I just have a lot of faith in Washington Sundar.

[00:41:02] I don't know why.

[00:41:02] I can't explain it.

[00:41:03] But, like, I knew that if he's batting, we will get a lead of 50.

[00:41:08] Right?

[00:41:08] I had a feeling that he will close the gap more narrowly in the second innings

[00:41:13] than what ended up happening.

[00:41:14] But he was under too much pressure.

[00:41:17] And so my prediction is he's going to play ahead of Ashwin in Australia.

[00:41:22] Okay.

[00:41:22] And that's contentious because I went back and checked and Ashwin played all the

[00:41:26] games in the last Australia test season.

[00:41:27] Except for the last one, but he was injured.

[00:41:29] Yeah.

[00:41:30] Injury.

[00:41:30] Yeah.

[00:41:31] But my gut feel is that he's going to play ahead of Ashwin,

[00:41:35] especially in the first two games.

[00:41:37] And I think we just got to figure out his batting order.

[00:41:41] By default, by being the junior most, I think he has to come after Jereja.

[00:41:47] But I am all for mixing things up and sending him at, you know, a four or five if needed.

[00:41:53] But I just have a lot of faith in the guy.

[00:41:56] I think he is part of the future of this team.

[00:41:58] Yeah.

[00:41:58] Couldn't agree more.

[00:41:59] I think really well said.

[00:42:01] DJ, the last one I have to talk about before we wrap up this painful experience.

[00:42:05] But we talked a lot about Rohit and Kohli.

[00:42:08] We've talked a little bit about the future.

[00:42:09] We talked about these guys.

[00:42:10] There's one spot in that lower to middle order that you and I talked a lot about K.L.

[00:42:16] Raul.

[00:42:16] And then we talked about Sarfra.

[00:42:17] Can't even blame him.

[00:42:18] He hasn't played the last two test matches.

[00:42:20] No, this is what I'm saying.

[00:42:21] So we wanted Sarfra.

[00:42:23] And then, man, I think the pitch was acting out a little bit.

[00:42:28] But then he hit a sweep off a full toss straight down the throat of the field.

[00:42:34] And I think I texted Varun.

[00:42:35] That was the game for him.

[00:42:38] He was done.

[00:42:38] Yeah.

[00:42:38] I texted Varun saying, well, you can't even blame the pitch when you don't let the ball bounce.

[00:42:42] And you get out to an easy full toss.

[00:42:44] I mean, I think he made zero and one in this test.

[00:42:48] You don't ever want to judge a player off of one.

[00:42:50] But it just showed an absolute lack of decision-making skill.

[00:42:57] It just seemed to show that, I guess in a post-Pujara world, it seemed to show we have too many guys,

[00:43:02] whether you count Jaswal, Panth, Sarfra, there's too many guys who are like,

[00:43:05] well, I have license to go because somebody else will consolidate.

[00:43:08] And when everybody is like that, you become England.

[00:43:10] And you'll win some phenomenal matches, but you will lose some absolute shockers too.

[00:43:16] Yeah, I agree.

[00:43:17] So I'm just going to rewind to the start of the series where the KL Rahul, this debate was ongoing.

[00:43:24] And I said, listen, I think KL will play the first test match.

[00:43:27] But if you were to replace KL, I would have gone with Dhruv Jarrell.

[00:43:32] And the reason I'd said that was technically Dhruv Jarrell just looks like a more organized, more compact, better temperamentally.

[00:43:42] After that, Noki played against England with the series imbalance.

[00:43:46] Played a magnificent innings of 90.

[00:43:49] He just looks like a great player of spin and someone who can play extreme pace as well.

[00:43:56] He looks organized, right?

[00:43:58] Of course, when we dropped KL, we went to Sarfra's.

[00:44:02] He scored 150.

[00:44:04] After a guy scores 150, what are you going to do?

[00:44:06] But the problem with that is it's the lack of consistency, right?

[00:44:10] So you're yo-yoing, and I say that without any, like, I don't mean anything by the reference to yo-yo.

[00:44:19] But you're oscillating between being sublime and being ridiculous.

[00:44:24] And today he was absolutely ridiculous.

[00:44:26] He came out with it.

[00:44:27] You say lack of decision-making.

[00:44:29] I don't think so.

[00:44:29] I think he made the decision, I'm going to sweep every ball.

[00:44:32] He got full-toss first ball, swept it.

[00:44:34] He would have smacked it anywhere for four.

[00:44:36] I guess I meant lack of good decision-making.

[00:44:38] Good decision.

[00:44:39] It was bad decision-making.

[00:44:40] It was definitely a bad decision-making.

[00:44:41] Because they come out thinking, we have to sweep.

[00:44:44] And he's hit the first one for one.

[00:44:46] And then the next one, he smokes down deep midweek at his throat.

[00:44:49] And you're just like, what?

[00:44:51] They just, it was like, it was a really poor shot.

[00:44:55] And again, he played a great knock.

[00:44:58] He got 150 in that first test match after being 46-0 out.

[00:45:05] And he played that because Gil was injured.

[00:45:07] But my question should have, is like, should Jurel have actually played instead of Sarfraz once Gil is back and KL has been dropped?

[00:45:16] And it's hard to drop someone after two tests, one test match of not performing, which he did in the second one.

[00:45:21] But after watching the ways he's got out in the last three innings, or four innings, I mean, even the second test first innings, he just lobbed one to mid-off.

[00:45:31] Is that what you want to see from your middle order?

[00:45:34] Or would you rather have someone more organized, temperamentally better?

[00:45:39] Yes, Jurel is a wicketkeeper, but he doesn't have to keep, right?

[00:45:42] It doesn't mean that the Rishabh pun spot is under scrutiny.

[00:45:47] But a 5-6 should be solid.

[00:45:49] Should be able to play both games.

[00:45:51] And I think Sarfraz has got, like, basically one gear, which is overdrive.

[00:45:57] Yeah.

[00:45:59] Paran, does KL Rahul play in Australia?

[00:46:01] Yeah, so I was just going to say, let's just wrap up very quickly.

[00:46:04] The two contentious picks for me are KL Rahul and Sundar will play the first test in Australia.

[00:46:10] Those are my two picks.

[00:46:11] But no change to Rohit Kohli, Jaiswal, Gil.

[00:46:13] No, no.

[00:46:14] I mean, Rohit, if he's not there, that's a different story.

[00:46:16] Sure, sure, sure.

[00:46:17] Why aren't we liking Jurel for six, though?

[00:46:20] I'm a big Jurel fan.

[00:46:22] I've really liked his temperament.

[00:46:23] I think we do.

[00:46:24] I think we do.

[00:46:25] I am also with you.

[00:46:26] And again, I was telling somebody today that I hope he can play as a pure batter.

[00:46:30] But the feedback I'm getting is, it's just early.

[00:46:34] He will.

[00:46:34] He will.

[00:46:35] It's just early.

[00:46:36] That's the thing.

[00:46:37] But KL Adhi is like 20 or something in Australia.

[00:46:39] So he's had his shots.

[00:46:40] But anyway.

[00:46:41] But again, we said middle order.

[00:46:42] So I'm saying KL and Sundar are going to play in the first test because I think they need that.

[00:46:47] And I think we're only going to bat till 8.

[00:46:49] That's the reality.

[00:46:50] We cannot bat till 9 unless we play Akshar Pratel or Nitish Kumar ready.

[00:46:56] And I don't think India is going to do that, at least in the first couple of games.

[00:47:00] And the first test is the Wacker, right?

[00:47:02] Yeah.

[00:47:03] It's the new...

[00:47:04] Oh, the new Parth Grant.

[00:47:05] Sorry.

[00:47:06] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[00:47:06] Right here.

[00:47:06] So I wonder...

[00:47:07] So if...

[00:47:08] Sorry, just staying with that thought.

[00:47:11] If KL plays and Rohit doesn't play, does KL open the batting?

[00:47:15] Ishwaran opens the batting.

[00:47:17] So we're okay with putting a guy who's never played test cricket in front of the new ball

[00:47:22] at the Perth Stadium.

[00:47:24] I actually think if Rohit doesn't play, I suspect KL Ra will be shunted up the order

[00:47:29] as he's done before.

[00:47:31] And someone like Jurel will actually bat 6.

[00:47:34] Man, the thing with Jurel is I don't disagree with you at all, but that's all true for India.

[00:47:39] Like to play him first in India, cement his spot and then take him overseas.

[00:47:43] It just seems crazy to not make the 11 in India and say, yeah, but now you're good enough

[00:47:48] to make the 11 in Australia.

[00:47:48] That's the frustration.

[00:47:49] It's the same as Isfara.

[00:47:50] It's the same thing.

[00:47:51] But it's the same as KL.

[00:47:52] You're not good enough to play the last two test matches against New Zealand, but we'll

[00:47:55] play in Australia.

[00:47:56] Like where's the logic there?

[00:47:57] It's just because Sarfraz hit the 150.

[00:47:59] I think that's it.

[00:48:00] And I do think Sarfraz can get more runs in India.

[00:48:06] I'm trying to justify it, but I just don't think Jurel is part of the playing 11 plan today.

[00:48:11] It's a tough day actually to be having this conversation.

[00:48:14] Yeah, it's a very difficult day.

[00:48:15] We're all very charged and emotional about it.

[00:48:16] Anyway.

[00:48:17] All right.

[00:48:18] Well, on that happy note, there's not a lot else to say.

[00:48:21] We've gone way over what I thought we would.

[00:48:22] Varun, IPL retention has also happened this week.

[00:48:25] In any other week, this would have been a full episode for the Edge of this Legends Cricket Podcast.

[00:48:29] We were to spend all the time talking about it.

[00:48:31] MS Dhoni is uncapped officially in the system.

[00:48:34] Do you want to very quickly do a rundown of some of the highlights and lowlights of the

[00:48:37] IPL retentions for us?

[00:48:38] Yeah.

[00:48:39] So it's absolutely no surprise that the three most useless teams in the history of IPL have

[00:48:45] got the highest purse going into this strategy.

[00:48:50] Every two years, Punjab says, now we're going to rebuild.

[00:48:54] Punjab has 110.5 crores.

[00:48:58] I'm sure 50 of those are going to go to Samkaran, but everything else they've still got, right?

[00:49:05] So Punjab has 110 crores.

[00:49:08] Bangalore, the other Stalworth team has 83.

[00:49:11] And then the last mega team, Delhi Capitals has 73 crores.

[00:49:16] There is a lot of money that is going to be spent on absolutely useless decisions in December.

[00:49:26] If I'm trying to sum it up, it's almost close to 250 crores that is going to be thrown down

[00:49:32] the drain.

[00:49:34] But interesting that Kishan hasn't been retained, right?

[00:49:38] Yeah.

[00:49:38] So now on a more serious note, I think let me come to this.

[00:49:42] The couple of names that are interesting, right?

[00:49:44] Pant is not for Delhi Capitals.

[00:49:47] We heard that he wanted captaincy and apparently they're doing some rotation policy like it's

[00:49:51] a grad intern program or something.

[00:49:54] Or a kindergarten program.

[00:49:56] Like everybody today, your captain, today's Tuesday, our job captain.

[00:49:59] Wasn't that what KKR did?

[00:50:01] That shit before captain?

[00:50:02] No, no, no.

[00:50:02] This is not rotation policy of captain.

[00:50:04] This is part Jindal will manage the team for two years and GMR will manage the team for

[00:50:08] two years.

[00:50:08] Which is why you're seeing like Venugopal Rao as the key figure of the Delhi Capitals.

[00:50:14] Like just, again, just brilliant.

[00:50:18] So, so Ponting has left Delhi Capitals.

[00:50:23] Shreyas Ayer has left KKR.

[00:50:26] Again, wanted number one slot, wanted the money, didn't think of the kind of team dynamics.

[00:50:33] And then the third one is KL Rahul has left Lucknow where the owner came out and said, we

[00:50:39] wanted people with a winning mindset, not a personal mindset.

[00:50:41] Yeah, that was a, that was a weird dig, man.

[00:50:45] Honestly.

[00:50:46] So you've got, these are the three big names.

[00:50:51] I, I expect these three.

[00:50:52] I mean, I think Rishabh Pant is going to go for the highest.

[00:50:55] Now, there have been...

[00:50:56] Man, on Shreyas, really quick.

[00:50:58] We forget that he just literally just lifted the trophy for them.

[00:51:02] I mean, that's going to be some sort of record, right?

[00:51:04] In any sport, anywhere in the world, the captain getting dropped after winning a trophy.

[00:51:08] I mean, I think the reality is how much did he do between Gambhir being there and then

[00:51:12] them having this team?

[00:51:14] How much did Shreyas Ayer actually do?

[00:51:15] I mean, today I feel like he had to offset the negative of Gambhir as a coach.

[00:51:20] And then, today it's feeling like Gambhir was a drag.

[00:51:23] But anyway, I just think Sunil Narayan needs Indian citizenship for Gambhir to thrive as a coach.

[00:51:28] But I think Shreyas is...

[00:51:32] I don't think...

[00:51:34] I'm not feeling bad for Shreyas because I think a lot of teams have talked to their players

[00:51:39] and done what is in the best interest of the team.

[00:51:42] That means Hardik and Sky are getting paid the same and less than Bumrah, for example, right?

[00:51:49] So for Shreyas to not realize the value of the team and to be asking for that much

[00:51:55] is, in my opinion, tough.

[00:51:59] And the KKR, I think, CEO or Chief Operations Officer actually came out and said he was number

[00:52:04] one on our list.

[00:52:05] But we have to think of multiple different factors.

[00:52:08] So, yeah.

[00:52:10] I don't know, Ashwin, if you think we should need to run through it all.

[00:52:13] We can probably leave that.

[00:52:14] No, I think we can do that next week.

[00:52:15] I think, for me, Shreyas becomes a captain somewhere.

[00:52:18] The question is to either Lucknow or Delhi go really big behind him or Punjab to become

[00:52:26] leader.

[00:52:26] And who gets Kishan?

[00:52:28] Because his ear will burst.

[00:52:30] That was your favorite part of the week, wasn't it?

[00:52:32] I mean, in a week where all these dramas have happened, at least you got some comedy value

[00:52:37] out of Ishaan Kishan behind the stumps in Australia.

[00:52:40] So guys, if you haven't seen that, go and check out our Twitter at One Tip One Hand.

[00:52:43] It's pretty funny, that whole Stump Mike episode.

[00:52:46] All right.

[00:52:47] The big news, though, just last point, the big news is that apparently CSK want Rishabh

[00:52:54] Pant.

[00:52:54] And it is such a beautiful plan to take over from MS Dhoni.

[00:53:00] I can tell you that I think CSK want Rishabh Pant.

[00:53:04] I think Rishabh Pant want CSK.

[00:53:07] But unfortunately, Punjab has 110 kronos.

[00:53:12] So Rishabh Pant, beware.

[00:53:15] You are probably going to end up at Punjab.

[00:53:18] Kings 11 or Punjab Super Kings or whatever the hell they're called.

[00:53:24] Rising Punjab Super Giant.

[00:53:26] Punjab Super Giants.

[00:53:27] You're probably going to end up there, Rishabh Pant.

[00:53:30] So just be careful.

[00:53:31] But I think there's an outside chance CSK get him.

[00:53:35] I think Punjab and Bangalore are just going to kill CSK over this decision.

[00:53:39] But anyway, let's see that.

[00:53:40] But it can be like a comedy show at Punjab.

[00:53:43] And Varun, do you remember the right to match rules?

[00:53:46] Because they've changed now, right?

[00:53:47] Because theoretically, Pant can end up back at Delhi.

[00:53:49] Shreyas back at KKR, I think, with right to match cards.

[00:53:52] I think the players are betting that they get bid up high amount and that the franchises

[00:53:56] need to all right match them with more, essentially.

[00:53:58] So in things like, you know, in a situation where I'll give you an example with Conway,

[00:54:02] right?

[00:54:03] Or Will Jacks or Jake Frazier.

[00:54:07] I think these are the prime right to match situations, right?

[00:54:11] I don't remember the rule.

[00:54:12] But in a situation like Shreyas or Pant, these have been active conversations.

[00:54:20] They have left because of a problem or a clash in thinking.

[00:54:26] And so my gut feel is these guys are not going to get an RTM.

[00:54:30] Even if they go lower than what they thought, they're not getting an RTM.

[00:54:33] The RTM is for guys, I think, who can make a difference.

[00:54:36] Like, I wouldn't be surprised if KKR uses an RTM for Phil Salt, right?

[00:54:40] Out of the blow.

[00:54:41] But he's done well.

[00:54:42] Those are the kind of things that I think will happen.

[00:54:44] Not a Pant and Shreyas.

[00:54:45] I can see a CSK using an RTM for Cheteshwik Pujara.

[00:54:51] He put up a video, a training video.

[00:54:54] Oh, today?

[00:54:55] No, just two days back or something saying, soar today.

[00:54:59] I'm ready.

[00:54:59] Soar today.

[00:55:00] So typical Pujara style like uncle, he put up a video that said, soar today, strong tour.

[00:55:06] And before the video started, he put on his Apple Watch to track his workout.

[00:55:10] And then he went off.

[00:55:12] You gotta love the guy.

[00:55:13] No, but that's good timing for Boda Gawaskar, man.

[00:55:16] We didn't actually talk about the Poo and Puranik comeback.

[00:55:17] He's the one we miss the most, right?

[00:55:19] Just tire out, come in, Stark and Hizzlewood.

[00:55:23] I mean, those guys probably can't sleep at night thinking of Pujara.

[00:55:29] You talk about Guilds 90, you talk about Rishabh's innings.

[00:55:32] And ultimately, Pujara was the difference maker, I think, in those two series wins.

[00:55:37] Shit, damn.

[00:55:38] Down under, right?

[00:55:39] We just don't have that anymore.

[00:55:40] Dravid, Pujara, and now there's that void in the ability of a player.

[00:55:45] I mean, I don't know how we've come back to chess cricket.

[00:55:48] There were those great memes, right?

[00:55:49] Where you had that monk smoking.

[00:55:52] One kid who was a smoking kid and one was a monk kid.

[00:55:56] The monk kid is obviously Pujara and Pantra the smoking kid.

[00:55:59] Man, amazing.

[00:56:01] Yeah.

[00:56:02] Those may be some of my favorite partnerships.

[00:56:04] It was Pujara and Pantra together.

[00:56:05] Yeah.

[00:56:06] Those guys.

[00:56:06] Pujara.

[00:56:07] He couldn't even hug him because they were bruised all over.

[00:56:09] So, he's just like, puked this awkwardly like, bye.

[00:56:12] Well done.

[00:56:13] Pantra.

[00:56:14] Man.

[00:56:15] Pantra.

[00:56:16] On that happy note.

[00:56:17] Do we think he's coming back though?

[00:56:19] For BGT?

[00:56:20] Specialist?

[00:56:22] No.

[00:56:23] Maybe if the whole team, all team players get injured.

[00:56:26] If people get injured and we go down 2-0 by huge margins or something, maybe he gets on a play.

[00:56:33] Yeah.

[00:56:34] On that happy note.

[00:56:36] On that happy note.

[00:56:37] For the fifth time, I'm going to try to wrap us up.

[00:56:40] Thank you everybody for listening.

[00:56:41] This has been the Edges and Sludges Cricket Podcast.

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