Diversity or Diversion? The Blair Fambro Confessions

[00:00:00] Yo Chad, what if I told you there's a platform that could completely revolutionize your hiring

[00:00:07] strategy in a matter of hours?

[00:00:10] Yeah, I'd call it bullshit.

[00:00:12] Well, it's not bullshit with AI for Jobs powered by our friends at This Way Global.

[00:00:18] Okay, I'm listening.

[00:00:19] Well, everyone else is fishing in the same old talent pools.

[00:00:23] AI for Jobs can source over 160 million diverse candidate profiles.

[00:00:29] This Way Global has established unique partnerships with over 8,500 trusted diversity partners.

[00:00:36] So wait a minute.

[00:00:37] All of the hard on-the-ground work is already done.

[00:00:40] That's right, cowboy.

[00:00:41] You can discover 300 qualified candidates per job rack instantly.

[00:00:46] Wow!

[00:00:47] It's like having a candidate sourcing magic wand.

[00:00:50] Dude, if you had a magic wand, you would have Mexican pizzas all day.

[00:00:55] Mmm.

[00:00:57] Stop distracting me, Sowash.

[00:00:59] AI for Jobs advanced matching algorithm analyzes past applicants using trillions of historical matching events and over 1,600 data points.

[00:01:09] Now that is what AI should be doing.

[00:01:11] Saving recruiters time on sourcing while they provide a white glove candidate experience.

[00:01:18] Let's wrap this shit up.

[00:01:19] I'm hungry.

[00:01:20] Listen up, kids.

[00:01:22] Revolutionize your hiring process today by jumping over to thiswaglobal.com and checking out AI for Jobs,

[00:01:29] where you can learn more about how to leverage AI for your recruiting instead of just writing poems and grocery lists.

[00:01:37] That is ThisWayGlobal.com.

[00:01:41] We out.

[00:01:44] Hide your kids.

[00:01:45] Lock the doors.

[00:01:46] You're listening to HR's most dangerous podcast.

[00:01:49] Chad Sowash and Joel Cheeseman are here to punch the recruiting industry right where it hurts.

[00:01:54] Complete with breaking news, rash opinion, and loads of snark.

[00:01:58] Buckle up boys and girls.

[00:02:00] It's time for the Chad and Cheese Podcast.

[00:02:03] Oh, yeah.

[00:02:07] What's up everybody?

[00:02:08] It is the San Diego Chickens favorite podcast,

[00:02:11] AKA the Chad and Cheese podcast.

[00:02:13] I'm your co-host Joel Cheeseman.

[00:02:15] Join us always.

[00:02:16] The Felix to my Oscar, Chad Sowash is in the house and we are excited to welcome Blair Fambro to the podcast.

[00:02:24] Where's the manager strategy and DI at Hershey.

[00:02:29] That's right.

[00:02:30] Blair, welcome to the podcast.

[00:02:31] Thank you for having me.

[00:02:32] One of the famous tasting companies of all of America.

[00:02:35] Still the number one chocolate bar in America, right?

[00:02:39] I mean, so Blair, a lot of our listeners won't know who you are.

[00:02:43] They know Hershey, of course.

[00:02:44] But give them a little bit about what makes Blair tick.

[00:02:47] What makes me tick is being motivated to make an impact on our organization.

[00:02:50] It gets me motivated in the morning.

[00:02:52] What can I say about myself?

[00:02:53] So I've been in the industry for 13 years now.

[00:02:55] So all of my background has been DE and I in town acquisition.

[00:02:58] So being based out of Detroit, Michigan, one of the things I've always been passionate about is working at the time for the auto industry.

[00:03:07] Trying to make an impact there.

[00:03:09] Yeah.

[00:03:10] Being from Detroit.

[00:03:11] That's all I heard.

[00:03:12] I've been working at the big three, working at the big three and one of the things I wanted to do was work there.

[00:03:16] But also had a passion about technology.

[00:03:18] So every company I worked for, it had a component of IT.

[00:03:21] So that's what motivates me, but also being a diverse workforce.

[00:03:26] Something I love to do.

[00:03:27] And are you a Lions fan, Blair?

[00:03:29] Absolutely.

[00:03:30] My Lions would be back in Super Bowl.

[00:03:31] You're off the ledge.

[00:03:32] How are you feeling about this season?

[00:03:33] I'm feeling good.

[00:03:34] You know what?

[00:03:35] It's funny because this is deep dive into that.

[00:03:37] In my entire life, this is the furthest I've seen the Lions go.

[00:03:40] Oh yeah.

[00:03:41] This was like a Super Bowl to me.

[00:03:43] But now let's see what they can do next year.

[00:03:45] Yeah.

[00:03:46] Is it a one off or do you think they can repeat?

[00:03:47] I think they can repeat.

[00:03:48] Okay.

[00:03:49] I think they learned their lesson.

[00:03:50] They have a good solid coach and we'll see what happens.

[00:03:52] Optimistic.

[00:03:53] Great coach.

[00:03:54] Great coach.

[00:03:55] Definitely.

[00:03:56] I mean, great coach, players.

[00:03:57] I was rooting for Lions because Lions...

[00:03:59] If you weren't, you didn't have a soul.

[00:04:01] Exactly.

[00:04:02] Who did not have a Super Bowl?

[00:04:04] I mean, come on man.

[00:04:05] And then yes.

[00:04:06] You know I was rooting for the Cleveland Detroit Super Bowl.

[00:04:08] Yes.

[00:04:09] That would have broken the NFL.

[00:04:10] That would have broken the internet.

[00:04:12] And so I know you are a Central Michigan grad,

[00:04:15] a proud MAC conference graduate.

[00:04:18] Just like me.

[00:04:19] Oh come on man.

[00:04:20] Come on.

[00:04:21] MAC conference.

[00:04:23] Or when are they joining a real conference?

[00:04:25] Anytime soon.

[00:04:26] Anyway.

[00:04:27] Chirp chirp bitch.

[00:04:28] Chirp chirp.

[00:04:29] Says no man ever.

[00:04:30] Okay.

[00:04:31] So real deep down personal question.

[00:04:34] Did they make you come to Hershey to actually like interview

[00:04:37] like the town Hershey?

[00:04:39] No.

[00:04:40] Everything for me was remote.

[00:04:42] Oh yeah?

[00:04:43] Do you want to go though?

[00:04:44] Because all the like documentaries and what I was like,

[00:04:46] I want to go.

[00:04:47] Yes.

[00:04:48] I don't want to be the blue boy or anything like that.

[00:04:50] But at the end of the day, that looks frigging...

[00:04:52] Real plump.

[00:04:53] Yes.

[00:04:54] Looks amazing.

[00:04:55] Yeah.

[00:04:56] I'm looking forward to visiting.

[00:04:57] I haven't visited yet.

[00:04:58] I've seen how this started but this summer I'm definitely going to go

[00:05:00] and definitely take out the amusement park they have there

[00:05:02] and get sugar wasted.

[00:05:03] Take the family down there.

[00:05:04] Sugar wasted.

[00:05:05] Is that what you said?

[00:05:06] Wow.

[00:05:07] That's a whole waste that I haven't experienced yet.

[00:05:10] Okay.

[00:05:11] So here you're newbie at Hershey so we're not going to dig into that.

[00:05:13] Okay.

[00:05:14] We're going to give you a little time before we have you back on the

[00:05:16] show then we'll talk a little bit about Hershey.

[00:05:18] Talk a little bit about GM, transition to Twitter.

[00:05:21] Let's talk about that because you grew up Detroit.

[00:05:24] Yeah.

[00:05:25] Big three.

[00:05:26] That's what you knew.

[00:05:27] Yeah.

[00:05:28] Right?

[00:05:29] And then you had a chance to go to GM.

[00:05:30] How did that feel?

[00:05:31] Was that kind of...

[00:05:32] Did that feel like, oh man, here we go, promised land.

[00:05:34] Was your mom proud?

[00:05:35] Yeah, she was definitely proud.

[00:05:36] Even though my family is more on the Chrysler's

[00:05:39] slant side, I was still proud to be a part of the GM.

[00:05:43] It was great because for me that's all I grew up seeing either

[00:05:46] for Chrysler or GM.

[00:05:48] So working there it was exciting because when I came in,

[00:05:51] GM was bringing everything in-house.

[00:05:53] So you think about what they'd done over the years

[00:05:55] and all the employees they hired,

[00:05:57] they always did things from an RPO perspective.

[00:05:59] Yes.

[00:06:00] So I was able to come in and be the first wave hired in

[00:06:02] 2016 to support their IT division.

[00:06:04] So being successful with that, coming into an organization

[00:06:08] and building their IT division, not only in Detroit,

[00:06:12] but Atlanta, Phoenix, and also Austin, Texas.

[00:06:14] Wow.

[00:06:15] I think that was amazing.

[00:06:16] And that pretty much spearheaded my career into other areas.

[00:06:19] So if you look at what GM is doing now with the

[00:06:22] electrification vehicles, with the electric Hummer,

[00:06:24] the Silveradoes, at one point I was the recruiter

[00:06:27] hiring people to design those batteries.

[00:06:30] Yeah.

[00:06:31] And that was a sign to say, hey, on my resume,

[00:06:33] if you see the shift in the automotive industry,

[00:06:36] I played a huge component in that in regards to the

[00:06:39] hiring aspect of it.

[00:06:40] But then I had the opportunity to be a D&I lead

[00:06:43] for the organization, for engineering.

[00:06:45] So that's pretty much solidified every way to

[00:06:49] be well-rounded within TA and diversity.

[00:06:52] That role pretty much spearheaded where I am today.

[00:06:55] What did that consist of though?

[00:06:57] Because we've talked about on the show there have been

[00:06:59] a lot of DEI leads that just didn't get the resources

[00:07:03] necessary to actually move the needle.

[00:07:05] It didn't feel real, right?

[00:07:08] You were put in a position where you didn't have

[00:07:10] the resources necessary.

[00:07:11] Was it a scrap?

[00:07:12] Was it a fight?

[00:07:13] What was it about?

[00:07:14] Or did you get the resources you thought you needed

[00:07:16] to actually move the needle?

[00:07:17] It was both.

[00:07:18] And the reason I say that because GM had a strong

[00:07:20] presence in regards to diversity.

[00:07:22] Yeah.

[00:07:23] And not in TA but in regards to the global

[00:07:25] diversity team that wasn't responsible for TA.

[00:07:27] Yeah.

[00:07:28] So I had the support system there but I pretty much

[00:07:31] had to fight to say hey if we want to make an impact

[00:07:33] from a TA perspective we need to make some adjustments.

[00:07:36] And I had to make business case of certain resources,

[00:07:39] certain conferences and to get certain visibility

[00:07:42] for my colleagues.

[00:07:44] A lot of people didn't understand diversity

[00:07:46] from a higher-risk perspective.

[00:07:48] A lot of people were intimidated by having those conversations.

[00:07:50] In Detroit they didn't understand diversity

[00:07:52] in a higher-risk way.

[00:07:54] Yeah.

[00:07:55] And it was about 85% to 95% diversity.

[00:07:57] Yes.

[00:07:58] So it was something I was passionate about

[00:08:00] and I needed to spearhead that.

[00:08:01] Yeah.

[00:08:02] And it was not focused just on Detroit

[00:08:04] and I think a lot of people from a location

[00:08:07] perspective didn't understand that or was intimidated

[00:08:10] by the discussion because you want to make sure

[00:08:12] that you're being sensitive to other people's needs

[00:08:14] but you want to make sure that you don't

[00:08:16] cross the line when communicating with someone

[00:08:18] and for me I don't believe in crossing the line.

[00:08:21] I believe it happened open dialogue.

[00:08:22] Yeah.

[00:08:23] So I wanted to have those uncomfortable conversations

[00:08:25] and one of the things, it's my pet peeve

[00:08:27] if you feel a certain way, tell me how you feel.

[00:08:29] You don't, just because I'm a black male

[00:08:31] or considering a minority, you don't have

[00:08:33] to walk around eggshells.

[00:08:34] I want to know how you feel.

[00:08:35] I want to know your perspective.

[00:08:37] Yeah.

[00:08:38] So it's a learning curve for everyone.

[00:08:40] Oh yeah.

[00:08:41] So that's what was important for me.

[00:08:42] So sticking with GM for a second,

[00:08:44] seems like every week we talk about the United Auto Workers,

[00:08:47] another win, another notch on their belt.

[00:08:49] How do you feel being out of the industry

[00:08:51] knowing the unions and the win against the Big Three

[00:08:54] was diversity initiatives part of

[00:08:58] that maybe we didn't see in the mainstream media.

[00:09:01] What were your thoughts as the union

[00:09:03] was winning against the Big Three, the concessions?

[00:09:06] I thought that was huge for two reasons

[00:09:07] because I think the world was pretty much watching that.

[00:09:10] So everything from supply chain, automotive,

[00:09:13] anything that has to do with plants outside

[00:09:15] of the Big Three, people were watching that.

[00:09:17] I think they pretty much spearheaded

[00:09:18] what they were doing from a manufacturing perspective.

[00:09:21] And the diversity component,

[00:09:23] if you look at the numbers and the statistics,

[00:09:25] more minorities and women are in those factories.

[00:09:29] So from a diversity perspective,

[00:09:31] that was a huge win for them.

[00:09:33] Getting where they needed to be.

[00:09:34] We think about the fight of people

[00:09:36] who were working there for years

[00:09:38] as contractors, not getting those raises,

[00:09:41] not getting profit sharing.

[00:09:42] I think there was huge that people made that investment

[00:09:45] to work there five or 10 years

[00:09:46] and keeping the same compensation even during inflation.

[00:09:49] So being able to bring those people on board

[00:09:51] after 90 days

[00:09:52] and getting them what they felt that they deserve,

[00:09:54] I think it's great.

[00:09:55] That was a huge win.

[00:09:57] You were at GM during the George Floyd, the Me Too movement.

[00:10:01] What was it like being at a major corporation

[00:10:03] as these huge social events were happening

[00:10:06] and how did you see maybe opinions change

[00:10:09] or processes change during that time?

[00:10:11] It was huge emotions from everyone.

[00:10:14] It was a lack of understanding.

[00:10:16] It was confusion.

[00:10:17] It was unanswered results on what transpired for everyone.

[00:10:21] But one of the things I can say about the organization

[00:10:24] is that they made an environment

[00:10:26] for everyone to come together during that time.

[00:10:28] We had open discussions

[00:10:29] in regards to how individuals were feeling,

[00:10:31] no matter your background,

[00:10:32] what you've seen and what you believe.

[00:10:34] And I think that pretty much helped

[00:10:36] the organization come together as one.

[00:10:38] That's one thing.

[00:10:39] One of the things I can say

[00:10:40] I enjoy working about GM.

[00:10:41] When something transpired,

[00:10:43] I think we came together as an organization

[00:10:45] and even as a community to support one another.

[00:10:48] Is that the culture?

[00:10:49] The culture was like, we are our people.

[00:10:52] Most companies talk about that.

[00:10:54] They talk a big game,

[00:10:55] but it sounds like what you're talking about,

[00:10:57] GM actually believes it.

[00:10:58] Yeah, I believe they believe it

[00:11:00] because of the leadership that we have.

[00:11:02] The chief of diversity during the time I was there

[00:11:04] had a close relationship with her.

[00:11:06] I believe every initiative

[00:11:07] and I believe her passion

[00:11:09] based on the equity and inclusion and belonging.

[00:11:12] So that's what made me want to stay there for the long term.

[00:11:16] If you look at my background,

[00:11:18] I moved around a bit

[00:11:19] because I wanted to get every experience that I can.

[00:11:22] But if you look at my background,

[00:11:23] I stayed at GM the longest

[00:11:25] than any other organization.

[00:11:27] Good for you.

[00:11:28] Opportunities pop up.

[00:11:29] You take the opportunities.

[00:11:30] Let's talk about the other side of the coin on that one.

[00:11:32] Let's talk about Twitter.

[00:11:33] Okay, so because that culture

[00:11:35] changed dramatically while you were there.

[00:11:38] So what was your position while you were there?

[00:11:41] And talk a little bit about that experience.

[00:11:43] So working at Twitter,

[00:11:44] I wasn't sure if I wanted to leave GM or go to Twitter,

[00:11:48] but I can tell you the experience,

[00:11:50] just the interview experience blew me away.

[00:11:52] Really?

[00:11:53] Yeah, one of the things,

[00:11:54] and I've always been based in Detroit, Michigan.

[00:11:56] So working for a company that's based in San Francisco,

[00:11:58] culture was different.

[00:11:59] People were different.

[00:12:00] But going through that process

[00:12:02] and learning about the culture

[00:12:03] and what they're looking to do.

[00:12:04] And one of the reasons why I decided to go to Twitter

[00:12:06] because I was going to work on something new.

[00:12:08] No one was doing machine learning

[00:12:10] like Twitter and like the metas of the world.

[00:12:12] So I wanted to get my hands on that

[00:12:14] to be able to say,

[00:12:15] hey, I worked for an organization

[00:12:17] that did the electric vehicles.

[00:12:19] Now I'm working for an organization

[00:12:20] that's doing machine learning.

[00:12:21] That's just forward-looking.

[00:12:22] I mean, come on, batteries, machine learning.

[00:12:25] I mean, because that was before

[00:12:27] the big drop of chat GBT, right?

[00:12:30] Yeah, right before that.

[00:12:32] So when I was at Twitter,

[00:12:34] I was doing pretty much,

[00:12:35] if you use Twitter

[00:12:36] and you notice the recommendations

[00:12:38] or who connect with the news feeds.

[00:12:40] I was a senior technical source of there

[00:12:42] hiring the people

[00:12:43] that pretty much worked on that platform,

[00:12:46] the recommendations, news feeds and...

[00:12:50] Okay, listener,

[00:12:51] how can you help your employees

[00:12:53] become more productive?

[00:12:55] I have answers.

[00:12:56] How about automating manual

[00:12:58] and repetitive tasks,

[00:13:00] giving meaning to data,

[00:13:02] then allowing that data

[00:13:03] to actually drive decisions?

[00:13:05] And how about matching people

[00:13:07] to your jobs quicker?

[00:13:09] Well, wait.

[00:13:10] The Chattin' Cheese has a new LLM?

[00:13:13] No, cheeseman.

[00:13:14] I'm talking about Tex Colonel.

[00:13:16] Ah, okay.

[00:13:17] That makes more sense.

[00:13:19] What I'm hearing is the groundbreaking concept of

[00:13:22] wait for it.

[00:13:23] Simplicity.

[00:13:26] Seriously though, seriously.

[00:13:28] Tex Colonel cuts through the complexities

[00:13:30] like a tortilla chip

[00:13:32] through some hot nacho cheese.

[00:13:34] Oh my God.

[00:13:35] Really?

[00:13:36] Nacho references already.

[00:13:37] Anyways,

[00:13:38] Tex Colonel brings efficiency

[00:13:40] and productivity to your operations.

[00:13:42] Tex Colonel seamlessly unifies

[00:13:44] your tools and data

[00:13:46] to drive efficiencies and success.

[00:13:49] Tex Colonel is creating new opportunities

[00:13:52] for your recruitment journey.

[00:13:54] Kind of like adding guac

[00:13:56] to my barbacoa burrito.

[00:13:58] Oh my God.

[00:13:59] How about extracting meaningful insights

[00:14:01] from data?

[00:14:02] I mean, that's something.

[00:14:03] Swiftly matching people with jobs,

[00:14:06] automating repetitive tasks.

[00:14:08] Who knew such advanced concepts

[00:14:11] were even possible in the land

[00:14:13] of human resources?

[00:14:15] We did, Chad.

[00:14:17] We did.

[00:14:18] Dude, wrap it up.

[00:14:19] I'm a little hungry.

[00:14:21] Imagine that.

[00:14:22] Okay, listener,

[00:14:23] get ready to use today's tech

[00:14:25] to drive efficiencies and productivity.

[00:14:27] Visit TexColonel.com.

[00:14:29] That's T-E-X-T-K-E-R-C-E-R.

[00:14:32] K-E-R-N-E-L.com.

[00:14:36] Mmm, nachos.

[00:15:02] So you can allocate your budget based on insights,

[00:15:05] not hunches.

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[00:15:25] At Acquire ROI, we make job advertising easy.

[00:15:28] Visit us at AcquireRoy.com

[00:15:31] to learn more about transforming your talent acquisition today.

[00:15:34] We're talking about data scientists,

[00:15:36] or what are we talking about with regard to the types of positions

[00:15:39] that you were actually hiring for?

[00:15:40] Data scientists were part of it,

[00:15:42] but NLP, natural language process was one of the...

[00:15:45] So predictive text, things from that perspective

[00:15:47] that I was able to do.

[00:15:49] Before leaving Twitter, exiting Twitter,

[00:15:51] I was also a part of their security team.

[00:15:53] So anything from,

[00:15:55] if you think about the security aspect of it,

[00:15:57] if you think about safety or abuse,

[00:15:59] or child abuse or anything that happens on Twitter,

[00:16:02] I was responsible for that.

[00:16:04] Also, it's the overall privacy.

[00:16:06] And one of the things is if you create a Twitter account

[00:16:09] and you deactivate your account,

[00:16:11] Twitter can keep your information for a year.

[00:16:13] But the government requires them to delete all that information

[00:16:16] to keep your privacy safe.

[00:16:17] So I was responsible for that.

[00:16:19] And I felt that each part of the team I worked for at Twitter

[00:16:22] was impactful and I think it was innovative.

[00:16:24] So I pretty much enjoyed that.

[00:16:25] So Linda Yaccarino today

[00:16:27] was identified in front of Congress

[00:16:29] that they had all the security protocols buttoned up.

[00:16:33] Everything was good.

[00:16:35] Although they decimated a lot of the staff,

[00:16:38] like 80% of the staff.

[00:16:40] So the question is to the public out there,

[00:16:43] how can you stay secure with less people?

[00:16:47] Can AI help us be more secure?

[00:16:49] Because it's almost like that's how many of the companies

[00:16:52] want us to think.

[00:16:53] We don't need people to do this.

[00:16:55] So is AI going to keep us secure?

[00:16:57] Absolutely not.

[00:16:58] I don't believe that one bit.

[00:16:59] You're going to always have people.

[00:17:01] One of the things I like to say about AI

[00:17:03] is it's just going to help us work more efficiently.

[00:17:05] It's more like a Google Assistant to be

[00:17:07] where it's helping you enhance your day-to-day experience,

[00:17:10] but it's not going to take away anything

[00:17:12] that we do from a security perspective.

[00:17:14] I don't know how they're doing it with less people.

[00:17:16] I don't know how secure it is.

[00:17:18] But I think once they start to pick up again

[00:17:21] and each tech company,

[00:17:22] they're probably going to be the biggest area of hiring security.

[00:17:25] I mean, without security, the platform is no good.

[00:17:28] You can have mediocre machine learning,

[00:17:30] but if you don't have security,

[00:17:31] your platform is not going to last long.

[00:17:33] You've been part of some incredibly competitive industries,

[00:17:36] the car industry,

[00:17:38] not just the big three,

[00:17:39] but Germany and Japan.

[00:17:41] You've gone to Silicon Valley.

[00:17:43] You've got Facebook, Google,

[00:17:45] all the other tech companies,

[00:17:47] the hot, cool startups that are there.

[00:17:49] Talk about how you approached recruiting

[00:17:51] in such competitive industries.

[00:17:53] And how did you think about DEI

[00:17:55] being an advantage over your competition

[00:17:58] and helping you recruit top talent?

[00:18:00] That's funny because my aspect,

[00:18:02] when I think about recruiting,

[00:18:04] I think about my style.

[00:18:06] I try to mimic a programmer.

[00:18:08] And the reason I say programmer is because

[00:18:10] although my title has been recruiter,

[00:18:12] I've always been a sorcerer.

[00:18:13] So how do you find talent?

[00:18:15] It's being able to come up with unique site commands,

[00:18:17] unique coding to find individuals.

[00:18:19] And sometimes you have to have that mentality

[00:18:21] to be able to find those individuals.

[00:18:23] And what helped me stand out

[00:18:25] opposed to other recruiters is

[00:18:27] being able to do things recruiters won't do.

[00:18:29] And for me, a lot of recruiters are excellent

[00:18:32] in regards to negotiation, in regards to other things.

[00:18:34] But in regards to finding those purpose quarrels,

[00:18:36] that was my advantage.

[00:18:38] And I wanted to beat the competition by doing that.

[00:18:40] I felt that at one point I didn't have the gift of gab

[00:18:42] to have that salesman approach.

[00:18:44] So I said, what can I do behind the scenes

[00:18:46] to outwork them?

[00:18:47] Find your superpower.

[00:18:48] Yeah. And I think the sourcing aspect

[00:18:50] was always my superpower to outwork them

[00:18:53] and find candidates that they wouldn't be able to find

[00:18:55] instead of relying on the ATS.

[00:18:57] That was my superpower, but I can say for me,

[00:19:00] Dee and I really became a passion

[00:19:03] when I started working at Hewlett Packard.

[00:19:05] And this is when I really was sitting in the tech industry

[00:19:07] outside of the staffing world.

[00:19:09] And I never seen diverse teams.

[00:19:11] It was all male dominated.

[00:19:13] And I seen it, you know what?

[00:19:14] How are these hiring practices?

[00:19:16] How do you build diverse teams?

[00:19:18] Or, you know, you had ERG groups in the organization

[00:19:21] that people weren't leveraging.

[00:19:22] So I say, you know what?

[00:19:23] How do I work with these people?

[00:19:25] This was back in 2013.

[00:19:26] And I was still mid in the industry.

[00:19:28] So how do I tap them with people that's already here

[00:19:30] to engage with people?

[00:19:31] How do I network with them and learn

[00:19:33] what they're doing outside of the organization

[00:19:35] so I can get engaged with those individuals?

[00:19:37] And I started to do more speaking engagements,

[00:19:39] talking about diversity, inclusion, and in tech industry.

[00:19:42] And that's a pretty much, you know what?

[00:19:44] This is going to be my niche.

[00:19:45] I have the background with engineering, IT.

[00:19:47] But a lot of people are not invested

[00:19:49] in the diversity aspect of it.

[00:19:51] Because the reason diversity is important

[00:19:53] because your company is more profitable.

[00:19:55] Everyone is a customer.

[00:19:56] And at the end of the day, I look at an organization.

[00:19:58] The only thing that matters is the financial gain.

[00:20:01] When it comes to that, when it comes to a business growing

[00:20:03] and constantly growing,

[00:20:04] but when customers and even myself

[00:20:06] when I see individuals that are flexible with myself

[00:20:09] or are flexible with someone who's not myself,

[00:20:10] I think that diversity is diversity of thought.

[00:20:12] One of the things I always looked at

[00:20:14] was when I hired people that tech industries,

[00:20:17] the only one of people from tech industries, why?

[00:20:20] You're just hiring the same people

[00:20:21] with the same thought process.

[00:20:22] What if you bring someone from banking

[00:20:24] that does things a different manner?

[00:20:26] They have a different process.

[00:20:27] They can implement what they've done in the industry

[00:20:29] that you may not have thought of

[00:20:30] that the other companies are doing.

[00:20:32] So I took that approach

[00:20:33] and that pretty much helped me along my journey.

[00:20:35] Recently, it seems like a lot of companies

[00:20:38] are gutting their diversity efforts.

[00:20:40] They're laying off managers or executives

[00:20:42] that have taken those roles.

[00:20:44] We obviously see the Supreme Court of the country

[00:20:48] eliminate affirmative action initiatives.

[00:20:51] What are your thoughts on the future and present

[00:20:53] of DNI and where it's going?

[00:20:56] Are you bullish on it?

[00:20:57] Are you skeptical that it can have a future?

[00:21:01] Because obviously there was a lot of positivity

[00:21:03] in the wake of George Floyd, et cetera.

[00:21:05] Will it evolve?

[00:21:06] But now it feels like we're on the down slope.

[00:21:08] What's your take on that?

[00:21:09] There's two things.

[00:21:11] I will say, unfortunately with DNI and HR,

[00:21:14] we're always the first to go when it comes

[00:21:16] to big layoffs in that perspective.

[00:21:18] But I think seeing that is going to help

[00:21:21] more people gain opportunity

[00:21:23] outside of relying on the organization.

[00:21:25] I've seen more people have start-up companies

[00:21:27] since these layoffs of DNI than anything else.

[00:21:30] I see it changing because I think that people,

[00:21:32] the customers and also the employees

[00:21:35] are going to enforce that.

[00:21:36] They said the same thing about working remotely.

[00:21:38] It's not going to work.

[00:21:39] It's not going to be impactful.

[00:21:41] People are finding against that,

[00:21:42] but the people are actually finding

[00:21:43] against working remotely

[00:21:44] and changing the workforce as we see today.

[00:21:46] And then you think about it,

[00:21:47] there is another generation coming up.

[00:21:49] With the Gen Z, they are extremely passionate

[00:21:52] about diversity, equity and inclusion.

[00:21:54] They're also passionate about work-like balance.

[00:21:56] So companies are going to have to adjust

[00:21:58] with the generations upcoming

[00:22:00] because they're going to be the ones

[00:22:01] to make the demands.

[00:22:02] One thing I can say,

[00:22:04] once the market increases

[00:22:05] and we're seeing that diversity

[00:22:07] being cut, HRs being cut,

[00:22:09] I think in 2025 and 2026,

[00:22:11] when people are starting to hire again,

[00:22:12] people are going to remember this.

[00:22:14] All the layoffs, getting laid off by emails

[00:22:16] and things from that perspective.

[00:22:18] People are going to remember this

[00:22:19] and I think there's going to be a shift

[00:22:20] in the next two years.

[00:22:21] I think DNI is going to come back stronger

[00:22:23] than it has.

[00:22:24] People are going to remember you, Blair.

[00:22:25] We appreciate it, my friend.

[00:22:26] Even though he didn't bring

[00:22:27] any Hershey bars to the interview.

[00:22:29] Next time.

[00:22:30] I'm a little better on that.

[00:22:31] Next time.

[00:22:32] Alright, next time.

[00:22:33] He's new.

[00:22:34] He's new.

[00:22:35] Give him some time.

[00:22:36] I'm going to connect with you.

[00:22:37] Where can they find you?

[00:22:38] So you can find me on LinkedIn.

[00:22:39] It's Blair Fambro.

[00:22:40] Or you can find me on YouTube.

[00:22:41] I have a YouTube channel that talks

[00:22:43] about tips and tricks, interview tips.

[00:22:45] Nice.

[00:22:46] Sourcing tips.

[00:22:47] You can find my name on there.

[00:22:48] It's your HR Connect.

[00:22:49] So feel free to follow me on YouTube

[00:22:51] and also just click check me out on LinkedIn.

[00:22:53] I look forward to connecting with you all.

[00:22:55] You heard it here first.

[00:22:56] DNI is going to be back in 25

[00:22:59] in the future.

[00:23:00] Another one in the can everybody.

[00:23:02] We out.

[00:23:03] Thank you for listening

[00:23:05] to what's it called?

[00:23:07] A podcast.

[00:23:08] The chat.

[00:23:09] The cheese.

[00:23:10] Brilliant.

[00:23:11] They talk about recruiting.

[00:23:13] They talk about technology.

[00:23:15] But most of all, they talk about nothing.

[00:23:17] Just a lot of shout outs of people

[00:23:19] you don't even know.

[00:23:21] And yet you're listening.

[00:23:22] It's incredible.

[00:23:23] And not one word about cheese.

[00:23:26] Not one cheddar.

[00:23:28] Blue.

[00:23:29] Nacho.

[00:23:30] Pepper Jack.

[00:23:31] Swiss.

[00:23:32] So many cheeses.

[00:23:33] And not one word.

[00:23:35] So weird.

[00:23:36] Anywho, be sure to subscribe today

[00:23:39] on iTunes, Spotify, Google Play

[00:23:42] or wherever you listen to your podcasts.

[00:23:45] That way you won't miss an episode.

[00:23:48] And while you're at it, visit www.chatcheese.com.

[00:23:54] Just don't expect to find any recipes

[00:23:57] for grilled cheese.

[00:23:59] It's so weird.

[00:24:00] We out.

[00:24:03] The Jim Stroud Podcast explores the discoveries

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[00:24:12] Brain to brain communication,

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