Interview With "The Dead Don't Hurt" Director/Writer Viggo Mortensen & Star Vicky Krieps

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[00:01:32] You are listening to the Next Best Picture podcast, and this is my interview with the

[00:01:37] director, star, writer, producer, and film star, Vicky Kremes.

[00:01:46] Damn you, Weston!

[00:01:48] Goddamn it!

[00:01:49] So where are you from?

[00:01:57] Vivienne, Lacour-Dix.

[00:01:58] It's a very long story.

[00:02:01] I have plenty of time.

[00:02:08] Why did you go to San Francisco?

[00:02:11] To see the end of the world.

[00:02:13] This is it?

[00:02:14] The place you chose of all the places you have seen.

[00:02:17] No flowers, no garden at all.

[00:02:20] You live like a dog.

[00:02:21] A happy dog.

[00:02:22] You have to tell me what you want me to plant your trees.

[00:02:31] You're still a dog.

[00:02:32] Can I have your attention, ladies and gentlemen?

[00:02:36] I am Sergeant Webb of the California Regiment.

[00:02:39] We need volunteers who want to fight to save the Union.

[00:02:41] We're looking for men of honor.

[00:02:42] I'm thinking about enlisting.

[00:02:46] This is not your problem.

[00:02:47] This is not your country.

[00:02:48] It's the right thing to do, fighting against slavery.

[00:02:50] We have a life together now.

[00:02:53] It is only beginning.

[00:02:55] Be my wife.

[00:02:57] You cannot make things right with a consolation prize.

[00:03:00] I don't sense being all alone on a night like this.

[00:03:07] No different than any other.

[00:03:09] I am fine, Mr. Jeffries.

[00:03:11] Oh, you most certainly are.

[00:03:12] I'm Matt with Next Best Picture.

[00:03:16] First and foremost, I need to start off by saying, Vigo, Lord of the Rings changed my

[00:03:19] life.

[00:03:20] It's the reason I'm here.

[00:03:21] I cannot thank you enough for those movies.

[00:03:23] So truly thank you.

[00:03:26] Vicky, nice seeing you again.

[00:03:27] I've seen you a couple of times over the years, but I'm so glad to be having you on the show

[00:03:31] for the first time.

[00:03:32] Let's get into it here.

[00:03:34] I want to first start off, Vigo, I know from those infamous Lord of the Rings documentaries,

[00:03:38] you have a connection with nature.

[00:03:41] You love your horses.

[00:03:43] Can you tell me a little bit about how that found its way into your second directorial

[00:03:47] film here, The Dead Don't Hurt?

[00:03:49] And Vicky, what was it also like, how that environment that the two of you worked in

[00:03:53] informed your performance?

[00:03:55] Well, once I realized I was writing a Western, I got the most out of it.

[00:04:01] I was determined to do that.

[00:04:03] I mean, I grew up watching Westerns.

[00:04:05] I also grew up riding horses from when I was a little boy.

[00:04:09] And I like being around them as creatures.

[00:04:12] I find them interesting.

[00:04:13] And you can learn a lot from them.

[00:04:15] You have to be respectful.

[00:04:17] They're very big and they can hurt you also if you're careless and stupid, you know, and

[00:04:22] disrespectful.

[00:04:23] So all of that, I was looking forward to doing that and with a bunch of people and being

[00:04:27] on horses and being in those landscapes.

[00:04:29] I thought this could be, it'll be a lot of work, but if we do it right, but it'll be also

[00:04:35] enjoyable.

[00:04:36] Yeah.

[00:04:37] Yeah.

[00:04:38] I think, so landscape, I think of before he reached out to me, I was shooting a very different

[00:04:46] movie, a Belgian movie about the border of the US to Mexico in Arizona in that kind of

[00:04:53] landscape.

[00:04:54] And I suddenly had the image that I actually would like to be on a horse.

[00:04:58] It made no sense to be in a car.

[00:05:01] And then I also thought of the Western and all the many wars and the blood that's been

[00:05:05] shed of that land, thinking I should probably do Western next.

[00:05:11] But that, I just thought of it like that.

[00:05:14] Going to work one day.

[00:05:15] Yeah.

[00:05:16] Yeah.

[00:05:17] Going to set one day in a car thinking it should be a horse.

[00:05:19] And then the same week or one week later, I got this email from Vigo saying that he would

[00:05:24] like to send me something and then it was a script for Western.

[00:05:31] So maybe the landscape was first.

[00:05:33] Yeah, maybe.

[00:05:35] So Vigo, you knew you wanted Vicky right away.

[00:05:38] What qualities did she possess that you already knew about from her previous work?

[00:05:42] And then what qualities did you discover from actually working with her?

[00:05:46] Well, I had not met Vicky before.

[00:05:49] I'd just seen her work on screen and I had not seen her in the theater and I had not

[00:05:54] seen all her movies.

[00:05:55] I'd just seen some.

[00:05:57] But I felt like she had all the qualities that I was hoping to see in Vivienne.

[00:06:06] And I also knew that she was a very particular kind of artist.

[00:06:11] It felt that way watching her on screen and that she would find even more things than

[00:06:15] I could imagine.

[00:06:16] That's what I felt instinctively could be.

[00:06:20] But you never know.

[00:06:21] I mean, you can dream that someone will play a role that you've written, but they might

[00:06:25] read it and not like it.

[00:06:26] Or maybe they did something similar and they don't want to repeat themselves.

[00:06:30] Or they're just not available.

[00:06:32] That happens.

[00:06:35] And sometimes people take a long time to reply and you're waiting, you're hoping.

[00:06:39] But in the case of Vicky, she answered right away.

[00:06:43] And she liked it.

[00:06:44] And I didn't know, she told me later about this, that she was thinking about a Western

[00:06:48] not long before.

[00:06:50] And here it was like a message.

[00:06:52] Okay, here it is if you want to do it.

[00:06:55] And she connected on some level, I think you connected, you told me the Joan of Arc aspect

[00:07:01] of the story and all that.

[00:07:03] So it was great.

[00:07:05] Then I knew that we were off to the races and we just had to surround her with good

[00:07:09] actors and make sure we told the story well.

[00:07:13] I knew that she would create a really original Vivienne character.

[00:07:20] And she did more than I dreamed of.

[00:07:23] Then he knew that I was even more stubborn than he thought I was.

[00:07:26] What did I get to know afterwards?

[00:07:29] We both are, we both have very strong opinions.

[00:07:32] But in the end we both listen to each other, which is important.

[00:07:36] And I think that's the way the characters are.

[00:07:37] They're both stubborn and they make their, especially him, he can be clumsy but make

[00:07:42] mistakes but they're proud and they have their ideas.

[00:07:45] But they are curious about the other person and that's crucial for any relationship to

[00:07:50] work.

[00:07:51] Sure.

[00:07:52] And flipping it over to you now, Vicky, on to Vigo.

[00:07:54] Can you tell me what is it like working with someone who is not only the director but then

[00:08:00] also the writer, the co-star, the producer of the film, wearing all these different hats?

[00:08:05] How is that different than working just opposite a regular co-star or dealing with a director

[00:08:11] who's only the director?

[00:08:12] So first of all I find it really interesting because the question comes a lot and people

[00:08:17] actually use that word, wearing different hats.

[00:08:20] I find it so interesting that you would be so interested in this and that you have the

[00:08:26] sensitivity to understand that that would affect an actor.

[00:08:29] I'm really surprised that so many people think about that.

[00:08:32] And it's true.

[00:08:34] And I had worked with directors who are actors, who have been actors before, which makes it

[00:08:41] a bit easier sometimes because there's a sensitivity to the work.

[00:08:46] But in this case, as you point out, there were all these different people, like five

[00:08:50] different people.

[00:08:53] And it was a challenge to me but it became almost like I was schooling my acting because

[00:08:58] if you are in the presence of five different people in the body of one person, you have

[00:09:04] to make sure you know to who you're talking to or to who you're reacting.

[00:09:08] It was very important that if I was in a scene with Vigo and he was the actor, I had to react

[00:09:13] to him just as the actor, just like my acting scene partner and only take what he gives

[00:09:21] me there and not listen to if I would hear him then flip over to the other side and be

[00:09:26] the director and then talk to, I don't know, the assistant or talk to try and not hear

[00:09:33] that and only concentrate on the actor.

[00:09:37] And that was not easy because it was like I had him and then he was gone and then I

[00:09:42] had him again and then he was gone.

[00:09:43] And where is he now?

[00:09:44] Oh, now he's gone.

[00:09:45] Sound department.

[00:09:46] Now he's back.

[00:09:47] Light department.

[00:09:49] So I started having this relationship, strong relationship with the set.

[00:09:53] With the set.

[00:09:54] Yeah, with the set.

[00:09:55] So whenever you left, I would try and really concentrate on the champagne bottle or concentrate

[00:10:01] on some piece of clothing I would see on a person so that I would remain in the moment,

[00:10:07] you know what I mean?

[00:10:08] Like in the scene.

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[00:11:13] And my final question before we go here, Vigo, you could have easily have made a Western

[00:11:17] where your character is the lead character, the hero most screen time, but you didn't.

[00:11:23] You gave this role this beautiful role to Vicky.

[00:11:26] And she really carries this film for a prolonged period of time while your character is away.

[00:11:32] Can you tell me just a little bit about reshaping the Western through the female perspective

[00:11:38] and Vicky, what that means to you, especially as this is such a traditional genre within

[00:11:44] Hollywood that has not given that perspective before or not much?

[00:11:48] I was just curious about it.

[00:11:49] Like I said, I started writing a story about a woman and then turned into a Western.

[00:11:54] You know, I thought, well, a woman who's like that opening frontiers for herself just by

[00:11:58] being free thinking and independent, having her be on the Western frontier in the 19th

[00:12:07] century in a place that's kind of lawless, dominated by men.

[00:12:12] I thought that created a bigger obstacle for her.

[00:12:16] And that's basically what I wanted to explore.

[00:12:19] You know, what kind of woman is that?

[00:12:22] And what was her childhood like?

[00:12:24] Why is she the way she is now?

[00:12:26] And I wanted to give some hints as to that and let the audience figure out the rest for

[00:12:29] themselves and let Vicky fill in the feelings that have to do with that.

[00:12:35] I was open to what could happen, you know?

[00:12:38] And just as I'm open when you make a movie and you hand it over, you see the movie, it's

[00:12:43] your movie.

[00:12:45] And if you tell me, I see this and I think this is what you're talking about, I mean,

[00:12:49] I've never thought of that, but I can't say it's not true because it's your movie now.

[00:12:52] You know what I mean?

[00:12:54] And I like that process.

[00:12:56] But among other things, I wanted to explore what happens to girls and women like Vivienne,

[00:13:01] you know, when their fathers or their brothers or their partners go off to war.

[00:13:06] You know, I hadn't seen that.

[00:13:09] And in a way, you made it her movie.

[00:13:11] Like you say, it's your movie, it might not be my movie.

[00:13:14] And you made it the woman's movie, which is not usually what you do.

[00:13:18] And I find...

[00:13:20] So for me, what was most interesting about this or moving on you is that Viggo was not

[00:13:25] trying to give it a particular reason, you know?

[00:13:28] So we're not turning the camera onto her because she's a superhero or because she's...

[00:13:35] You know what I mean?

[00:13:36] Like she's not doing anything.

[00:13:37] She's just a woman.

[00:13:39] But the camera decides to follow her and to see her.

[00:13:43] And this was so moving to me because, you know, so often I think of my grandmother and

[00:13:48] my grandmother, grandmother, grandmother, grand, grand, all these millions of women

[00:13:53] who have built societies.

[00:13:55] You know, it's always the women who've built, you know, the Western town, but also who built

[00:14:00] any kind of town or any kind of...

[00:14:02] And the families.

[00:14:03] Families and holding the families together.

[00:14:05] The whole African continent is hanging on a few women, you know, like who hold everybody

[00:14:11] together.

[00:14:13] And these women are never yet the center of attention.

[00:14:17] And this is what is so beautiful, is that the camera just very politely and in a humble

[00:14:22] way turns onto the woman.

[00:14:25] And this to me is a very...

[00:14:28] Une lettre d'amour.

[00:14:30] A love letter to the women.

[00:14:34] It should be normal.

[00:14:35] It shouldn't be so unusual and probably it'll be less and less so.

[00:14:40] One because you have more and more female directors.

[00:14:44] But also because hopefully men are evolving as well.

[00:14:48] And it's not just, oh, I should tell a story about a woman.

[00:14:52] No, I'm interested in it.

[00:14:54] You have to be...

[00:14:55] If you like what you're doing and you're interested in the story you're telling, you're going

[00:14:58] to enjoy it more and you're going to do a better job.

[00:15:01] So it's just a question of people being interested.

[00:15:04] And one way to create interest is by doing it.

[00:15:07] You know, so we told a story that's about a woman and you get to know her childhood.

[00:15:12] You don't get to know her male partner's childhood in this story.

[00:15:15] It's about her.

[00:15:16] And he goes off to war.

[00:15:17] You don't go to war, you stay with her.

[00:15:19] What happens to her?

[00:15:20] And I think gradually it's natural that there'll be more stories like that.

[00:15:25] They don't have to be just stories like that but I think there's lots of stories that haven't

[00:15:30] been told.

[00:15:31] I'm sure there were many Vivian's in the West.

[00:15:33] Had to be.

[00:15:34] Or just like in your family.

[00:15:35] But you know, your grandmother and their grandmother and so forth.

[00:15:40] But they just, men have mostly told the stories until now.

[00:15:47] Or the stories that have been published.

[00:15:50] And their interest wasn't in telling those stories.

[00:15:52] They were more interested in what the guys were up to.

[00:15:55] And you know, I think it doesn't mean that Vivian is extraordinary.

[00:16:01] She's like an ordinary woman.

[00:16:03] And there were probably many like them.

[00:16:05] Tough, strong psychologically, you know.

[00:16:07] It's just a matter of being interested in telling those stories.

[00:16:11] Well, both of you, thank you so much for your time here.

[00:16:13] I really appreciate it.

[00:16:15] As I said, this was a thrill for me.

[00:16:16] And best of luck to both of you.

[00:16:18] Thank you.

[00:16:19] You too.

[00:16:20] Bye.

[00:16:21] Take care.

[00:16:22] Hey everyone, thank you so much for listening to my interview with the director, writer,

[00:16:24] producer, star and composer for the film The Dead Don't Hurt, Viggo Mortensen.

[00:16:29] And the film's star, Vicky Kripps, here on the Next Best Picture Podcast.

[00:16:34] The Dead Don't Hurt is now playing in theaters from Shout Studios.

[00:16:40] You have been listening to the Next Best Picture Podcast.

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[00:17:03] Thank you all so much for listening as always.

[00:17:05] We will see you all next time.

[00:17:55] Hello and welcome to Novel Conversations, a podcast about the world's greatest stories.

[00:18:00] I'm your host, Frank Lovallo.

[00:18:02] And for each episode of Novel Conversations, I talk to two readers about one book.

[00:18:06] And together we summarize the story for you.

[00:18:09] We introduce you to the characters, we tell you what happens to them, and we read from

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